Is STO doing things?
04-06-2020, 09:33 PM,
#1
Is STO doing things?
Is STO realized only by doing things for others?

Or simply loving others is that STO as well?

Doubt everything. Find your own light. - Buddha
https://www.intentionrepeater.com
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04-06-2020, 10:25 PM,
#2
RE: Is STO doing things?
I think is about acts and thoughts.
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04-07-2020, 08:06 AM,
#3
RE: Is STO doing things?
   What is service to others?
   Consider the example of a parent’s relation to their young child.
   Not only does the parent love the child in thoughts, but engages in actions for the child by offering protection, care for its physical needs, and words of encouragement and comfort.
   I think that one of the greatest examples of service to another person is to give them a smile when you see them.
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flofrog
04-07-2020, 10:05 AM,
#4
RE: Is STO doing things?
I think there is nothing wrong with sending love.

However, honestly, why would we incarnate in the first place if sending love would be sufficient?

How does sending love help somebody struggling with loneliness, somebody starving and so on?
How does merely sending love help people heal?
Sure, entities who are not incarnate obviously have to send love, I mean, they are not here physically.

If you look at it from a perspective of healing, you might notice that almost any issues we can have originated in some kind of relationship.
So, in order to heal, we need to heal relationships.

If we dont heal our relationships, if we stay isolated, not daring to really connect and relate, is the exclusive sending of love actually really a service or is it an expression of our own problems?

This is not to devaluate any service, but I think, the difference between delusion and service is, delusion is a potential we can feel but never „bring into the world“, whereas a true service, that is really helpful, involves bringing that potential into the world.
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04-07-2020, 01:39 PM,
#5
RE: Is STO doing things?
(04-07-2020, 10:05 AM)Agua Wrote:  I think there is nothing wrong with sending love.

However, honestly, why would we incarnate in the first place if sending love would be sufficient?

How does sending love help somebody struggling with loneliness, somebody starving and so on?
How does merely sending love help people heal?
Sure, entities who are not incarnate obviously have to send love, I mean, they are not here physically.

If you look at it from a perspective of healing, you might notice that almost any issues we can have originated in some kind of relationship.
So, in order to heal, we need to heal relationships.

If we dont heal our relationships, if we stay isolated, not daring to really connect and relate, is the exclusive sending of love actually really a service or is it an expression of our own problems?

This is not to devaluate any service, but I think, the difference between delusion and service is, delusion is a potential we can feel but never „bring into the world“, whereas a true service, that is really helpful, involves bringing that potential into the world.

I totally agree Agua. I think sending love when you feel it deeply probably affects in a different way a current vibration, as the same time we did come to incarnate and it is a privilege and it's not to just sit there Wink
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Agua
04-07-2020, 06:34 PM,
#6
RE: Is STO doing things?
I agree with Agua.

I have however also noticed a theme, more central in some spiritual circles and also brought out in Q'uo channeling, where the counterpoint is made that people often focus too much on "doing" and too little on "being". There's much to explore in that, relating to what is really STO and the nature of the human condition.

Gurdjieff has it that "in order to Do, it is necessary first to Be". Gurdjieff's teaching centers around the poor state of being of humanity, and the need to develop the lower being in order for conscious doing to really become possible. In that sense, moralizers who push people to endlessly do for others are directing others to put the cart before the horse.

Yet, people naturally tend to be the most concerned with "what to do", not "how to be". Life tends to present a flow of pressing matters which make the question of "what to do" central.

Those who can do something well, however small and simple it may be, have enough "being" that it is possible to "talk seriously with them" about spiritual matters, according to Gurdjieff. But he found that for the most part, people simply "do things just anyhow", as if mindless machines, even when great emotion or great thought is involved.

I have been thinking that the Q'uo, and other sources, who advise people to focus on "being" do so because generally, people are not capable of sensibly "doing" all that much. If "being" was in order, then the most generally helpful advice may have been very different.

There's a lot which, if done in the world, could greatly help others. Sometimes individuals are given clear choices and opportunities to do something great. But in general, the flow of what humanity does on the mass scale looks like water circling a drain.
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04-07-2020, 06:35 PM,
#7
RE: Is STO doing things?
I think that if my mom is yelling at me and I choose to respond with love rather than anger, then that is a service.

Doubt everything. Find your own light. - Buddha
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04-07-2020, 07:00 PM,
#8
RE: Is STO doing things?
(04-07-2020, 06:34 PM)Asolsutsesvyl Wrote:  I agree with Agua.

I have however also noticed a theme, more central in some spiritual circles and also brought out in Q'uo channeling, where the counterpoint is made that people often focus too much on "doing" and too little on "being". There's much to explore in that, relating to what is really STO and the nature of the human condition.

Dont get hung up with words!

Although the same words are being used, these are two different things.

I absolutely agree, that being in „state of pure being“ and, if necessary and appropriate, act from that is absolutely desireable!

I was pointing to a different phenomenon:
Sitting at home, hiding behind a computer, afraid of connecting with the world and with fellow human beings and dwelling in the amount of love one has to give to the world instead of really manifesting this love or light or spirituality in actual life is, in my opinion, neither helpful for the human beings out there nor is it helpful for the seeker at home.
This life is about living it, connecting with life, with the world, the earth, with people. There is ample opportunity to serve and to grow.

One does not grow nor serve by dwelling in what could be instead of really manifesting it here in this world.

I hope I could clarify what I meant!
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04-07-2020, 07:23 PM,
#9
RE: Is STO doing things?
Other than that, I think polarity is greatly being misunderstood.
Its not so clear-cut
sto = volunteering in a soup kitchen
sts = torturing people

After all, wanderers incarnate here to gain polarity. If it were that easy, there probably wouldnt be much use of that.

I think we tend to view it on a superficial level too often, judging by the appeareance of the action.
I am pretty sure this is not what its about. Ultimately, you cannot judge or understand the action without realizing, what the underlying „parameters“ are, the true motivation, at the deepest level.
And more often than not, the true motivation is completely different from what it appears to be on a superficial level.

As long as we didnt significantly „investigate“ the deeper layers of our personality and have understood and healed the active forces and limitations „down there“ it is almost impossible to really polarize positively.
This is because, as long as certain things are not yet healed, we are mostly ego driven. The ego then is all we know, we derive our sense of self from it.
And everything we do to protect it, defend it, safeguard it, reward it, inflate it is ultimately an investment in the ego and not in the True Self.

Ra, by the way speaks of certain requirements for harvest, 51% positive or 95% negative (if I got the numbers right).
Ever wondered why that is?
Seems to be a harder requirement for negative.
But I dont think we start at 50% each.
I would rather guess we all start at maybe 75% sts, which would reflect the ego-based way of life we normally have. From that starting point, which is surely more on the sts side even for an sto being (although the 75% are just a theory of mine), one eventually starts either investing in the ego (control, power) or in the True Self (surrender to what is).
This surely is simplified a lot, but I think thats a more realistic way and more applyable in life, in terms of polarizing.

When you view from that perspective, you will find a lot of hidden agenda behind many actions that seem to come from love but in truth are just ego based.
One of my teachers used to say „love is the ego ´s favourite disguise“

My take on polarity is more:
sts = investing in the ego
sts = healing the ego and investing in the true Self

In my opinion, for a long time on the path, one of the greatest service you can offer to the world is to heal yourself.
You will heal your part of the collective unconsciousness, bring a more loving and lightful energy to the table, and it will put you in a position where you can truly serve from your deepest heart.
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04-07-2020, 08:20 PM,
#10
RE: Is STO doing things?
(04-07-2020, 07:00 PM)Agua Wrote:  Sitting at home, hiding behind a computer, afraid of connecting with the world and with fellow human beings and dwelling in the amount of love one has to give to the world instead of really manifesting this love or light or spirituality in actual life is, in my opinion, neither helpful for the human beings out there nor is it helpful for the seeker at home.
This life is about living it, connecting with life, with the world, the earth, with people. There is ample opportunity to serve and to grow.

One does not grow nor serve by dwelling in what could be instead of really manifesting it here in this world.

I hope I could clarify what I meant!

That's a simple and sensible point. As it relates to myself, hiding in my personal life instead of being "out there" in some sense and actually bringing something to people is a long-running theme.

To be clear, I didn't have you in mind regarding moralizers who push people to do in an unbalanced way. That relates to faulty wishdom teaching I'm acquainted with.

My background complicates spiritual matters, as the teaching I was submerged in (The Cassiopaean version of "the Work") makes for extreme self-scrutiny and not really growing in what is smallest in oneself, but instead pushing it all aside in search for what is the "real self". The curious self-distance is a big stumbling block, in starting over in a healthier way. My inner guidance suggested that I had "built myself up and burned myself out" at the same time.

The best ideal I have preserved from those years relates to information and how it can help people. The sharing of information can be a very big thing, as the Ra contact shows. The obscuring of understanding can also be a very big thing, as negative imitations show. A future of positive social memory complexes means consciousnesses growing together, which means that whatever brings positive common ground helps, and the removal of artificial barriers between people also helps.

About Gurdjieff's basic point, it's easy to relate to how being messed up in the lower chakras prevents really "being" in what is "done". A stable presence in what corresponds to the fourth chakra corresponds, more or less, to having "crossed the second threshold", in Fourth Way terms, and is very far from how people start out. (The Fourth Way teaching is at an extreme in describing the usual spiritual accomplishments as all imaginary and achieving anything for real as very difficult.)
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04-07-2020, 08:28 PM, (This post was last modified: 04-07-2020, 11:52 PM by EvolvingPhoenix.)
#11
RE: Is STO doing things?
(04-06-2020, 09:33 PM)Great Central Sun Wrote:  Is STO realized only by doing things for others?

Or simply loving others is that STO as well?

You don't get brownie points just for supposed thoughts and feelings. The fact that you ain't DOING s*** indicates some unseen s***: blocked lower chakras preventing flow of prana into the heart. If your heart is truly open, your lower 3 chakras are highly unlikely to be y blocked.  Chances are, your solar plexus chakra by that point should be healthy enough that you are enacting your WILL in the world, in which case, you will NOT be merely thinking and feeling "love"

Most people pretend to be positive, but do not really have open hearts. They just go through the motions. Nothing wrong with that if you are self aware and know why you do it and how it serves you and why, in my opinion. After all, to open the anahata, one must first heal the lower 3 chakras. But if you're acting like your compassionate when you're not, you should be self aware and know why. My reason is simple: It will have to do until the anahata opens, and until then I work on my lower chakras and ethical behaviour is a strategic decision because even if you're "STS" it is unwise to have a heavy touch. Although I do not believe it true wisdom without compassion, but it's smarter strategy it seems. Elite members of elite LHP orders are not very focused on dominating others. They are focused on SELF mastery, with mastery over others being seen as a natural byproduct of self mastery. Difference is, they think opening the anahata is something to be avoided. But they might still behave with ethics/morality not just to put on a facade, but because it is simply less likely to cause them trouble. Why incur karmic bullshit trying to bully people around when you can have people come to you and willingly enslave themselves to you by simply becoming a powerful figure through self mastery?

Well, just adapt that strategy to realizing it's the best you can do until the anahata is open (with the intention of healing and clearing chakra blockages so you can open it on more than brief rare occaision) and you have a path that makes sense while being "positive" as you work on your chakras. Do not lie to yourself about your actual positivity either or you will not truly open your heart, you will just go through the motions.

And polarizing for the sake of polarizing doesn't polarize, because you are JUST going through the motions.

That being said, f*** polarity and f*** the STS/STO thing. In fact, I am at this point not so trustful of the LoO channelings. Having information channeled by a supposedly positive entity that is supposedly an alien SMC who was supposedly worshipped as a sun god is some very shaky s*** taken on absolute faith but why? And what is the idea presented? It seems to be: either be absorbed into some amorphous cosmic force or damn yourself to separation until loneliness forces you to submit and inevitably be absorbed by that amorphous cosmic force. So then the whole STO/STS thing really isn't much of a real choice at all. It's the illusion of choice. You are being told you have no choice but to inevitably give up your memories, identity, free will etc. to merge with the One. Where's the free will again? Maybe the free will is the free will not to buy into that s***. Sure, maybe all is one, but just because you FINALLY find a spiritual text that acknowledges that fact and puts it in positive sounding language doesn't mean the material isn't actually insidious. But who knows? Maybe that is the way s*** is. I don't know anymore and I'm not going to instantly assume it actually is how "Ra" says it is, nor that it's all bullshit either. Who knows?

But what I can say is this:

Even if it's true, does concerning yourself with being STS or STO really help you develop or advance? Is the label of STS or STO really actually all that helpful to your true realization of your Will or your self awareness?

How many truly happy people, "negative" or "positive" have YOU ever actually met? How many really exist in this world? How many people ACTUALLY have open hearts and how many are just going through the motions and not being honest with themselves about it?

I dunno, but I don't really see a whole lot of ACTUAL compassion in the world, not even from supposedly "positive" and supposedly "spiritual" people. I'm not just talking about religion either.

And as for the channelers? I mean, Carla was the kind of person so naive she fell for Nigerian email scams according to people who KNEW her. She refused to acknowledge that Don was abusive. She still clung to her Bible, even though so much of it is so distorted even if you believe in the LoO and Ra himself says the first half of it is mostly negative.

Sounds more like religious blind faith fanatacism trading in the Christian flavour for the new age spiritual flavour, but again, I don't know.

I'm not saying I am certain that the LoO channelings are BS, but I am beginning to think maybe the only reason a lot of us buy into it is because it seems truer than everything else we've heard before we came across it and maybe it's a lie told like any brilliant lie: with enough truth mixed in to bypass our instinctual filter for stuff that is BLATANTLY untrue, so the lies also bypass. Kinda like how storytellers tell (or at least attempt to tell in some cases) the truth (or at least as best they see it) in the opposite manner: by wrapping kernels of fiction into the truth and telling you it's fiction so it can bypass your egotistical scrutiny, you know?

I don't pretend to know. I'm beginning to really like that quote by Socrates even more than I always did: "All I know is that I know nothing"

Still, I don't  trust this whole LoO material anymore, not that I completely disregard it either.

But the fact of the matter is, even if it's true (and I guess in a sense it is, because all realities are true across infinity, but I mean the part of infinity we are ACTUALLY in and cannot change or something) does that mean just sitting around and saying you "feel" loving without actually DOING s*** that proves it really count? Not to me it doesn't. Talk is cheap, and so are supposed feelings that aren't backed by Will. If you mean it, PROVE it, I say. So many people seem positive, but they don't have open hearts and they don't admit it.

Maybe you can't really know for sure what reality is or what the rules are or whatever, but does following some set of spiritual "rules" even matter? Why would this information about 51% STO and 95% STS even MATTER? How does knowing the supposed "rules" really help us when the point is to figure out OUR WILL?

And how would sitting around "feeling" supposed "love" but not actually doing anything about it really have much meaning? I think if you really FEEL love and compassion, it would be signified by DOING things that were loving and compassionate and if you truly wished to serve others, you would be TRULY DOING stuff that served others with the deliberate intention of serving others. You wouldn't even have to force yourself. You would actually DO it because you would actually WANT TO do it.

But whatever.

I honestly think at this point the best STO thing somebody with  majour chakra blockage can do is work to heal themselves to unblock their chakras, so that a) the prana gets to the heart and b) they are in condition to actually serve and c) they actually WANT TO serve and d) they actually DO IT and e) they can heal others by healing themselves first. I would think that healing yourself would be the MOST EFFICIENT MEANS of healing everyone else because due to the inherent oneness of all things, what heals within yourself instantly affects the healing of other-selves because we are all one. This is why STS adepts who are highly crystallized mostly concern themselves with self mastery, because their will for control and dominance will NATURALLY affect group consciousness by the mere fact that they changed THEMSELVES towards that end. And because disempowered people who do not take responsibility for their own disempowerment naturally place that responsibility in the hands of other-selves who are more powerful in order to avoid taking responsibility, thus consenting to their own enslavement, consciously or at least unconsciously.

So in my view, HEALING is one of the best forms of service at least until one has healed enough to find their Will to serve in another manner. But healing still takes ACTION, not just "feeling" supposedly positive feelings while sitting around and changing nothing about oneself or one's life. Even if the action isn't extreme physical exertion or whatever, it has to be conscious choice to Do something with those feelings, or how does the solar plexus heal? And if the solar plexus is majourly underdeveloped, how does prana flow into the heart? In which case, what makes you think it's actually "love" you're feeling? And how can you be sure you're really FEELING it rather than just telling it to yourself and pretending that's how you actually feel? ESPECIALLY if the sacral ray is ALSO blocked.

Point is, I would say no. Merely "feeling" love is not STO, nor STS. It's not anything really. Even if your anahata IS somehow open with heinously blocked lower chakras, what meaning does that have when the lower chakras are blocked?

there's no way around it, until we do the WORK of making positive change, it's bullshit to say we're STO. Or that we're even truly serving ANYONE really. I mean, I GUESS it's technically actually STS to just sit around trying to feel good while not actually doing anything, but it's not even very powerful STS and isn't even the best way to serve only yourself. It's just not very servicable to anyone. Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to be harsh and condemning of that s***, because I mean, let's be real, I haven't exactly DONE much of anything over the years myself, but it's not helpful to be dishonest about it, or it won't change.

I would say no, JUST "feeling love" is not STO. It's BARELY even STS. Not gonna look down on people for it, because that's throwing stones from a mighty fragile glass house there, but it is what it is and it ain't what it ain't. It is BARELY STS and it is NOT STO. It's not really servicable, but if that's where somebody is at, that's where they're at. Change is inevitable. It's just that until they DO make some sort of meaningful change, living that way will cause one to suffer and it will NOT really help you develop, except for that the accumulated suffering in and of itself might just pile up so much as to be unbearable and get you off your ass in one direction or another.

But if one is operating on the idea that the LoO channelings are legit, and this forum does, then it is worth noting that Ra himself basically said when it comes to opportunities for STO polarization, it's use it or lose it. If you keep wasting opportunities to polarize positive, they will stop coming into your life.

I couldn't find the part where he says that, but he does in the LoO books.

Also, I DID find this:

6:14 Ra: The ability to polarize positively requires a certain degree of self determination.

Does just sitting around "feeling" love really sound like self determination to you, Gem?

It's not.

Not criticizing people who do that. I have done much sitting around myself. Just saying that no, it is not STO.


"My take on polarity is more:
sts = investing in the ego
sts = healing the ego and investing in the true Self"

First off, *STO = healing and investing in the true self.
Secondly, sitting on your ass and navel gazing and s*** IS NOT heling a damn thing and it is NOT investing in the true self.

STOP IT.

Just stop.

STOP bullshitting.

That is TOTALLY the ego talking. JUST ADMIT IT. How are you going to HEAL that s*** if you won't even ADMIT that s***?! STOP IT. Just stop. Jesus.
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04-07-2020, 09:23 PM,
#12
RE: Is STO doing things?
(04-07-2020, 08:28 PM)EvolvingPhoenix Wrote:  That being said, f*** polarity and f*** the STS/STO thing. In fact, I am at this point not so trustful of the LoO channelings. Having information channeled by a supposedly positive entity that is supposedly an alien SMC who was supposedly worshipped as a sun god is some very shaky s*** taken on absolute faith but why? And what is the idea presented? It seems to be: either be absorbed into some amorphous cosmic force or damn yourself to separation until loneliness forces you to submit and inevitably be absorbed by that amorphous cosmic force. So then the whole STO/STS thing really isn't much of a real choice at all. It's the illusion of choice. You are being told you have no choice but to inevitably give up your memories, identity, free will etc. to merge with the One. Where's the free will again? Maybe the free will is the free will not to buy into that s***. Sure, maybe all is one, but just because you FINALLY find a spiritual text that acknowledges that fact and puts it in positive sounding language doesn't mean the material isn't actually insidious. But who knows? Maybe that is the way s*** is. I don't know anymore and I'm not going to instantly assume it actually is how "Ra" says it is, nor that it's all bullshit either. Who knows?

[...]

Still, I don't trust this whole LoO material anymore, not that I completely disregard it either.

Maybe this post could be helpful, in describing the "method of exclusion" - that is, the way it is supposed to work/be engaged. I don't think positive idealism (the "method of integration") will work as a driving force for you, but "impartiality with the self" may, as a way of getting somewhere.

More idealistically driven people may get somewhere by distilling purer ideals, in some form, whether related to the LoO channeling or something else, and then sincerely striving towards them, both inwardly and outwardly. (Not easy.) More mentally and skeptically driven people may need to approach eveything differently in order to approach whatever is real by excluding everything which isn't. (Not easy either, but one way or the other will be a better fit for each person.)
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04-07-2020, 09:49 PM,
#13
RE: Is STO doing things?
I wanted to add some thoughts.

Perhaps there is some confusion between different types of wanderers. There are those wanderes who come into their incarnation with a set mission (i.e. Tesla), where family structure and fate are designed in such a way to guide that entity to be successful in causing specific (sometimes radical) change. Lets call these Type A

Then there is the type of wanderer that has incarnated in a wave, essentially arriving in a more random fashion, dispersed throughout the world. The only set mission being to "lighten the load", whatever that means. Say these are Type B.

I think it's easy for Type B to look upon Type A and almost feel inadequate. Type A seem to hit the ground running while Type B are left feeling a lack of direction or purpose. Their innate desire to serve, combined with the confusion of a very open-ended mission, results in the typical restless feeling felt by most here. Add to that the common trauma experienced of coming into the world with a much higher standard of what it is to be loved and accepted, and those around us not being able to see or return such a love, it is easy to see that compassion is in order for all souls involved.

Does it occur to anyone that these discussions are very important and valuable. That being "socially isolated", writing on a keyboard, putting your thoughts out there for all to see, is exactly the type of service you are best suited for?

These online communities can be a great comfort, especially during these times where so much of the world is in lock-down. Who cares if the numbers are not massive, Ra tells us not to count the numbers for a reason.

There is no need to throttle your own capacity for service due to comparison. If you do whatever you do in love and in truth, no matter how seemingly insignificant, then you are being of service.

Growing in your capacity to love and seek truth will only imbue the service you are already doing with more love and light.
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04-07-2020, 11:36 PM, (This post was last modified: 04-07-2020, 11:45 PM by EvolvingPhoenix.)
#14
RE: Is STO doing things?
"Perhaps there is some confusion between different types of wanderers. There are those wanderes who come into their incarnation with a set mission (i.e. Tesla), where family structure and fate are designed in such a way to guide that entity to be successful in causing specific (sometimes radical) change. Lets call these Type A

Then there is the type of wanderer that has incarnated in a wave, essentially arriving in a more random fashion, dispersed throughout the world. The only set mission being to "lighten the load", whatever that means. Say these are Type B.

I think it's easy for Type B to look upon Type A and almost feel inadequate. Type A seem to hit the ground running while Type B are left feeling a lack of direction or purpose. Their innate desire to serve, combined with the confusion of a very open-ended mission, results in the typical restless feeling felt by most here. Add to that the common trauma experienced of coming into the world with a much higher standard of what it is to be loved and accepted, and those around us not being able to see or return such a love, it is easy to see that compassion is in order for all souls involved."

Stop it. This bullshit notion that all you have to do is just sit around and feel good is a bunch of crap. And who says you're a wanderer? Have you pierced the veil enough to know? And even if you have, does that mean you know if everyone else here asking this kind of s*** is?

Sitting around and feeling good is not gonna make you happy and it's not gonna help you heal your trauma and it's not gonna be cponducive to self love and therefor, love of other self. That's bullshit.

Even if your primary mission is to raise the vibration of the planet by being on it or whatever crap, that doesn't mean your only mission is to just sit around feeling good.

And that'
s NOT gonna raise your vibration either, so even THEN you're not doing your mission right.

STOP IT.

Stop this nonsense that sitting around and doing nothing is in and of itself positive work. It's not. That's just an excuse to not change. And if you're gonna sit around, fine. That's cool with me, but I'm calling bullshit on this notion that doing so is positive work, that when one does it that it's because they're a wanderer, that it is one's mission to just sit around and not do anything, or some bullshit like that. If you're gonna sit on your ass all day, just own the fact that that's what you're doing and stop pretending you're actually being of service to anybody outside of yourself by doing it. It's really just the bullshit here that's getting my goat. Sitting around all day? Fine. But don't lie and say you're doing anybody outside of yourself some great service by not doing anything, just because you don't want to take the responsibility of changing. That is of NO service to ANYONE, yourself included.

Just be real: If you're sitting around all day, you are not doing s*** for anybody. Why? I dunno. Maybe because you're scared, confused, whatever. Okay fine, but that doesn't mean you're doing some act of service to others by trying to stay comfortable and avoid scary change because you're scared. IF that's what you're doing, just admit it. Don't pretend you're doing some act of service. You're not. You're serving yourself, but not even doing that strategically. It is what it is. It is not bad to cultivate patience with oneself about it. However, bullshitting about it will only make your own life worse if you do that s***. Might as well just be honest with oneself about it instead. Just own up to it. If you own up to it, that might even be the first step towards CHANGING it and healing yourself! THEN you will actually be DOING something for yourself and others.


And as for this notion of "I am doing the world my good service by sitting around and postulating on an internet forum" bullshit, please.

No you ain't. Let's just be real here. Most likely, you're telling yourself that sitting on your ass typing s*** up is your great service because IT IS EASY and it DOESN'T REQUIRE YOU TO TAKE RESPONSIBILITY OR CHANGE.

And I'm not gonna judge for that, but I'm not gonna pretend that it aint what it is. I'm not gonna pretend sitting on your ass and doing what is easy and comfortable and does not require personal responsibility or change just because it is within your comfort zone and doesn't threaten you is some serious act of service to the world.

It's not. It's just refusal of the call to adventure, because you're afraid to leave your comfort zone. That's fine, but ADMIT IT.
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04-07-2020, 11:38 PM,
#15
RE: Is STO doing things?
(04-07-2020, 09:23 PM)Asolsutsesvyl Wrote:  
(04-07-2020, 08:28 PM)EvolvingPhoenix Wrote:  That being said, f*** polarity and f*** the STS/STO thing. In fact, I am at this point not so trustful of the LoO channelings. Having information channeled by a supposedly positive entity that is supposedly an alien SMC who was supposedly worshipped as a sun god is some very shaky s*** taken on absolute faith but why? And what is the idea presented? It seems to be: either be absorbed into some amorphous cosmic force or damn yourself to separation until loneliness forces you to submit and inevitably be absorbed by that amorphous cosmic force. So then the whole STO/STS thing really isn't much of a real choice at all. It's the illusion of choice. You are being told you have no choice but to inevitably give up your memories, identity, free will etc. to merge with the One. Where's the free will again? Maybe the free will is the free will not to buy into that s***. Sure, maybe all is one, but just because you FINALLY find a spiritual text that acknowledges that fact and puts it in positive sounding language doesn't mean the material isn't actually insidious. But who knows? Maybe that is the way s*** is. I don't know anymore and I'm not going to instantly assume it actually is how "Ra" says it is, nor that it's all bullshit either. Who knows?

[...]

Still, I don't  trust this whole LoO material anymore, not that I completely disregard it either.

Maybe this post could be helpful, in describing the "method of exclusion" - that is, the way it is supposed to work/be engaged. I don't think positive idealism (the "method of integration") will work as a driving force for you, but "impartiality with the self" may, as a way of getting somewhere.

More idealistically driven people may get somewhere by distilling purer ideals, in some form, whether related to the LoO channeling or something else, and then sincerely striving towards them, both inwardly and outwardly. (Not easy.) More mentally and skeptically driven people may need to approach eveything differently in order to approach whatever is real by excluding everything which isn't. (Not easy either, but one way or the other will be a better fit for each person.)

That sounds interesting. I'll give it a look. Thanks!
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04-08-2020, 12:09 AM,
#16
RE: Is STO doing things?
(04-07-2020, 11:36 PM)EvolvingPhoenix Wrote:  "Perhaps there is some confusion between different types of wanderers. There are those wanderes who come into their incarnation with a set mission (i.e. Tesla), where family structure and fate are designed in such a way to guide that entity to be successful in causing specific (sometimes radical) change. Lets call these Type A

Then there is the type of wanderer that has incarnated in a wave, essentially arriving in a more random fashion, dispersed throughout the world. The only set mission being to "lighten the load", whatever that means. Say these are Type B.

I think it's easy for Type B to look upon Type A and almost feel inadequate. Type A seem to hit the ground running while Type B are left feeling a lack of direction or purpose. Their innate desire to serve, combined with the confusion of a very open-ended mission, results in the typical restless feeling felt by most here. Add to that the common trauma experienced of coming into the world with a much higher standard of what it is to be loved and accepted, and those around us not being able to see or return such a love, it is easy to see that compassion is in order for all souls involved."

Stop it. This bullshit notion that all you have to do is just sit around and feel good is a bunch of crap. And who says you're a wanderer? Have you pierced the veil enough to know? And even if you have, does that mean you know if everyone else here asking this kind of s*** is?

Sitting around and feeling good is not gonna make you happy and it's not gonna help you heal your trauma and it's not gonna be cponducive to self love and therefor, love of other self. That's bullshit.

Even if your primary mission is to raise the vibration of the planet by being on it or whatever crap, that doesn't mean your only mission is to just sit around feeling good.

And that'
s NOT gonna raise your vibration either, so even THEN you're not doing your mission right.

STOP IT.

Stop this nonsense that sitting around and doing nothing is in and of itself positive work. It's not. That's just an excuse to not change. And if you're gonna sit around, fine. That's cool with me, but I'm calling bullshit on this notion that doing so is positive work, that when one does it that it's because they're a wanderer, that it is one's mission to just sit around and not do anything, or some bullshit like that. If you're gonna sit on your ass all day, just own the fact that that's what you're doing and stop pretending you're actually being of service to anybody outside of yourself by doing it. It's really just the bullshit here that's getting my goat. Sitting around all day? Fine. But don't lie and say you're doing anybody outside of yourself some great service by not doing anything, just because you don't want to take the responsibility of changing. That is of NO service to ANYONE, yourself included.

Just be real: If you're sitting around all day, you are not doing s*** for anybody. Why? I dunno. Maybe because you're scared, confused, whatever. Okay fine, but that doesn't mean you're doing some act of service to others by trying to stay comfortable and avoid scary change because you're scared. IF that's what you're doing, just admit it. Don't pretend you're doing some act of service. You're not. You're serving yourself, but not even doing that strategically. It is what it is. It is not bad to cultivate patience with oneself about it. However, bullshitting about it will only make your own life worse if you do that s***. Might as well just be honest with oneself about it instead. Just own up to it. If you own up to it, that might even be the first step towards CHANGING it and healing yourself! THEN you will actually be DOING something for yourself and others.


And as for this notion of "I am doing the world my good service by sitting around and postulating on an internet forum" bullshit, please.

No you ain't. Let's just be real here. Most likely, you're telling yourself that sitting on your ass typing s*** up is your great service because IT IS EASY and it DOESN'T REQUIRE YOU TO TAKE RESPONSIBILITY OR CHANGE.

And I'm not gonna judge for that, but I'm not gonna pretend that it aint what it is. I'm not gonna pretend sitting on your ass and doing what is easy and comfortable and does not require personal responsibility or change just because it is within your comfort zone and doesn't threaten you is some serious act of service to the world.

It's not. It's just refusal of the call to adventure, because you're afraid to leave your comfort zone. That's fine, but ADMIT IT.

You read a lot into what I said. You also changed my idea of "contributing thoughts to an online community" as just "sitting around". Why? Who are you yelling at? Where am I? Do you see me? Do you know me? Do you want to know me?

Who should I be? Who do you want me to be, shall we discuss it? I like to do my service in just 15 minutes per day in the comfort of my own home. I'm a sucker for efficiency. Then I will enjoy all the self-congratulatory self-praise I indulgently bestow upon myself. Cool If you must know, my wanderer certificate came in the mail.

Hello laziness, thankyou for telling me that wasting time is not time wasted. Sorry you've been so misunderstood and misaligned.
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04-08-2020, 02:22 AM, (This post was last modified: 04-08-2020, 02:52 AM by EvolvingPhoenix.)
#17
RE: Is STO doing things?
Louisabell, the question posed was this: does one have to DO anything to be STO.

Meaning he is asking whether simply FEELING is enough or if DOING is enough.

I insist FEELING is not and DOING is necessary. At least if you're trying to polarize or whatever.

"Does it occur to anyone that these discussions are very important and valuable. That being "socially isolated", writing on a keyboard, putting your thoughts out there for all to see, is exactly the type of service you are best suited for?"

Gee, WHERE could I have gotten the notion that you are promoting the idea that just typing up s*** on a keyboard is enough? You didn't say "Typing on a forum is ONE act of service you can do" You said iot might be the kind one is best suited for.

I disagree. I think it's very EASY to get the notion that sitting around and just spending all day on the computer is an act of service, but it's not. And if you're saying that it's the "type of service one is best suited for" then that implies it is one's primary form of service, which means that naturally, one would spend a lot of time on the forum, thinking that spending all their time here was actually committing a service. I don't think it is. I think spending SOME time on the forum and contributing plays a serviceable role, but I honestly view the idea that it is the type of service one is best suited for as a dangerous notion. It gives people an easy out to say "Oh! Well! I spend time on this forum. I contribute, so I'm actually doing my highest service to the world. It's the best service I'm suited for"

NO IT'S NOT. You can do more. I'm not admonishing anybody if they don't. I'm just saying BE HONEST about it. THAT IS ALL I'M SAYING.


I am not "yelling" at anybody. Again, STOP IT.

You talk about "twisting words" How about twisting intentions/emotions?

My worry here is this:

Gem spends A LOT of time on here and then "sends love" and wonders if he's actually doing much, so he leaves a post like this.

Then YOU leave a post saying: "Oh, well, maybe contributing to the forum is what you're best suyited for as service"

And I DON'T think that is helping him. I think it's enabling him to say "Oh! Yeah, I send love and spend a lot of time on the forum! I guess that's enough"

And I see a danger in that.

I don't have a problem so much with people spending all their time on the net, but I DO have a problem with them telling themselves it's some great service to others.

Cool that YOU spend only 15 minutes on this site per day. Gem typically doesn't. And you did not make a qualifier like "As long as you do other stuff as well and don't spend too much time on this site"

I find your idea dangerous at least AS YOU PRESENTED IT. I was not judging YOU so there is NO NEED to know YOU. I am judging the merits of the concept you presented based on your choice of words for how you presented it.

Your choice of words suggests that if one spends their time "sending love" and talking a lot on this forum, they can call it a day and rest assured they're really doing some s***. I think that's only gonna keep people with a tendency to do that in a state of denial or confusion.

If you think posting on this site IS an act of service, fine. But make sure you qualify that kind of statement.

Otherwise, I think you SEND the wrong idea with how you communicate it. So don't get defensive and ask if I "know you" like I'm judging you when you say something like that to somebody who probably could use an honest assessment of the mattyer.

I never said there's anything WRONG with spending all one's time on the internet. It takes people as long as it does to find their way. I outright said I don't judge or throw stones from that glass house. I simply want people not to get it twisted and think that writing on this site and sending love is enough to really be of serious service. I don't think it is. Nothing wrong with that, but it's not good for people to be confused or delusional about it. It is what it is. It ain't what it aint.

that is ALL I'm saying. I'm not "yelling" at anyone and I'm explicitly not JUDGING for it. I'm just calling a spade a spade.

Tell me, why get defensive about it then? Because asking me if I know you (as if I would need to) in order to assess your idea based on how you presented it is basically defending yourself like you're being attacked or judged, when in reality, it's the IDEA that I'm basically calling out. And the idea that "writing on an internet forum is the service best suited for you" contributes to a deluded thinking that all one needs to do is send love and spend time on this forum and they're doing all the service they need to do to polarie or whatever, and I think that enables some pretty counterproductive behavioiur if the wrong people read that. It's NOT HARD to see where one could see that and think "Oh. well, posting on a forum IS my service. Guess that's enough"
It doesn't matter what YOU do. That is not the point.
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04-08-2020, 02:37 AM, (This post was last modified: 04-08-2020, 03:07 AM by EvolvingPhoenix.)
#18
RE: Is STO doing things?
And just to get it straight, YES I agree that posting on this site CAN be an act of service. I have met a number of people who have helped me quite a bit on this site. Agua and Reaper especially. Agua even posted some useful stuff in THIS thread.

But I DON'T think the stuff they post on this site is the service EITHER is best suited for. I think it is ONE aspect of their service.

So do I agree contributing on the forum is a service? Yes. Do I think it's a good idea to say "This might be the BEST service you're suited for"? No.

Also, I am aware laziness can be a virtue of efficiency, but that is NOT what I am talking about and that is NOT the problem I am seeing with your assertion as you worded it. I didn't read your post and think to myself "Oh! She's promoting making things easy and time efficient! That's No true service"

I thought "Oh s***, she's telling a guy who spends A LOT of time on this site that the time he spends on this site might be 'the best form of service suited for him' and that could EASILY get taken the wrong way"

And if you feel I took it the wrong way, well, CASE IN POINT.

I am not saying "laziness bad" I am saying "NOT DOING MUCH and just feeling love is not an act of service, just because you post on a forum while you do it" I'm not even saying it's something to feel bad about. I am just saying that no, it's not really all that STO. Not really. I'm just asying to CALL A SPADE A SPADE.

Who am I yelling at?

Nobody.


Oh, and this:

"Who should I be? Who do you want me to be, shall we discuss it?"

A) we are discussing it already, and B) It doesn't matter who I want you to be.

All I'm saying is, if you want to be STO don't pretend that's what you're being if you make "contributing to an internet forum" the "best service for you" while you adopt the notion that one is certainly a wanderer and therefore the type that must be just sent here to raise the vibration or some s*** like that. I have heard enough of that and I REALLY think it's a bad notion.

The question is WHAT DO YOU want to be? Do you want to be the person whose definition of serving others is "rasing the vibration" and sending love without doing much else because posting on an internet forum is the service best suited for you?

Or do you want to be somebody who does the STO thing?

Or somebody else?

All I'm saying is BE HONEST about it.

I don't actually care what you do, I just think it's a bad idea not to be honest about it.

Also, I don't think the wanderer identity helps most people. I think it's actually in most cases kind of an ego trap. And I think when people think they're wanderers, or lightworkers, or starseeds or whatever, they start to get all kinds of unhelpful notions based on that concept.

ESPECIALLY if they don't even know. If you haven't pierced the veil or been told by someone who has, I don't think it's a good idea to assume. Actually, even THOSE two I am at this point becoming skeptical of. I am becoming INCREASINGLY aware that stuff is not as it seems. And I think that's what's bothering me here: Stuff isn't as it seems, and yet thinking that it is, or thinking that it is what one wants it to be... it's like... I worry it's inherently limiting. Like a cage.

I dunno. What I'm saying is, this kind of stuff we tell ourselves? Often bullshit and often keeps us down.
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04-08-2020, 03:21 AM, (This post was last modified: 04-08-2020, 03:42 AM by Aion.)
#19
RE: Is STO doing things?
I would refer to the concept of Karma Niyama

Quote:Kamma Niyama
Kamma, or karma in Sanskrit, is the law of moral causation. All of our volitional thoughts, words, and deeds create an energy that brings about effects and that process is called karma.

The important point here is that Kamma Niyama is a kind of natural law like gravity that operates without having to be directed by a divine intelligence. In Buddhism, karma is not a cosmic criminal justice system, and no supernatural force or God is directing it to reward the good and punish the wicked.

Karma is, rather, a natural tendency for skillful (kushala) actions to create beneficial effects, and unskillful (akushala) actions to create harmful or painful effects

In particular, I would say any 'effect' in life is proportional to the energy invested. Little effort, little effect. Effort is not necessarily physical, though. A skillful action is one which has been invested in. I would say that to echo the notion that to 'be yourself' is the best service anybody can offer, but that doesn't mean you have to do a ton of things. Tending to a garden, being conscientious of wildlife and insects, choosing not to overconsume, petting the dog and making it happy, etc, etc, these are all positive acts.

Quote:27.13 Questioner: Is Love— is there a manifestation of love that we could call vibration?

Ra: I am Ra. Again we reach semantic difficulties. The vibration or density of love or understanding is not a term used in the same sense as the second distortion, Love; the distortion Love being the great activator and primal co-Creator of various creations using intelligent infinity; the vibration love being that density in which those who have learned to do an activity called “loving” without significant distortion, then seek the ways of light or wisdom. Thus in vibratory sense love comes into light in the sense of the activity of unity in its free will. Love uses light and has the power to direct light in its distortions. Thus vibratory complexes recapitulate in reverse the creation in its unity, thus showing the rhythm or flow of the great heartbeat, if you will use this analogy.

Although somewhat esoteric I think this passage is enlightening on this subject, since we know 'positive' is really just 'all-inclusive' using the heart, rather than skipping the heart which is the pattern of the 'negative'. (According to Ra lore, anyways.) However, what I have bolded is the key point in this case, the idea of the activity of 'loving' and the note that it is possible to do it in a distorted manner.

I think that learning to love in an undistorted manner is an interesting thing to consider in regards to 'what does it take to be STO' if we consider that there can be a gap between the intention and the action. If there was no significance in the action and all that mattered is the intention then there would be no learning or growth. It is actually the 'corrective' response that leads to the realization of wisdom. Thus, when it is seen that the action did not meet the intention, the action is adjusted, if one is conscious. However, often we repeat actions despite our best intentions. This is also the development of skill.

It begs the question whether or not the intention we think we have actually is a true, genuine desire, or if it is a mental construct that has been created by ourselves either by being influenced or 'it's just the right thing to do'. I think in general we get farther being honest and true with ourselves, even if our desires are not the most altruistic. Sometimes acknowledging our greediness can be an important step towards loving others more naturally, because we stop trying to be things we are not.

By that same notion, the actions we choose are often limited by the selection of our creativity, modeled on behaviours we have seen before.
The desire to be free is one of the brightest burning flames in the heart of humanity.
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04-08-2020, 03:33 AM,
#20
RE: Is STO doing things?
(04-08-2020, 02:37 AM)EvolvingPhoenix Wrote:  And just to get it straight, YES I agree that posting on this site CAN be an act of service. I have met a number of people who have helped me quite a bit on this site. Agua and Reaper especially. Agua even posted some useful stuff in THIS thread.

But I DON'T think the stuff they post on this site is the service EITHER is best suited for. I think it is ONE aspect of their service.

So do I agree contributing on the forum is a service? Yes. Do I think it's a good idea to say "This might be the BEST service you're suited for"? No.

Also, I am aware laziness can be a virtue of efficiency, but that is NOT what I am talking about and that is NOT the problem I am seeing with your assertion as you worded it. I didn't read your post and think to myself "Oh! She's promoting making things easy and time efficient! That's No true service"

I thought "Oh s***, she's telling a guy who spends A LOT of time on this site that the time he spends on this site might be 'the best form of service suited for him' and that could EASILY get taken the wrong way"

And if you feel I took it the wrong way, well, CASE IN POINT.

I am not saying "laziness bad" I am saying "NOT DOING MUCH and just feeling love is not an act of service, just because you post on a forum while you do it" I'm not even saying it's something to feel bad about. I am just saying that no, it's not really all that STO. Not really. I'm just asying to CALL A SPADE A SPADE.

Who am I yelling at?

Nobody.


Oh, and this:

"Who should I be? Who do you want me to be, shall we discuss it?"

A) we are discussing it already, and B) It doesn't matter who I want you to be.

All I'm saying is, if you want to be STO don't pretend that's what you're being if you make "contributing to an internet forum" the "best service for you" while you adopt the notion that one is certainly a wanderer and therefore the type that must be just sent here to raise the vibration or some s*** like that. I have heard enough of that and I REALLY think it's a bad notion.

The question is WHAT DO YOU want to be? Do you want to be the person whose definition of serving others is "rasing the vibration" and sending love without doing much else because posting on an internet forum is the service best suited for you?

Or do you want to be somebody who does the STO thing?

Or somebody else?

All I'm saying is BE HONEST about it.

I don't actually care what you do, I just think it's a bad idea not to be honest about it.

Also, I don't think the wanderer identity helps most people. I think it's actually in most cases kind of an ego trap. And I think when people think they're wanderers, or lightworkers, or starseeds or whatever, they start to get all kinds of unhelpful notions based on that concept.

ESPECIALLY if they don't even know. If you haven't pierced the veil or been told by someone who has, I don't think it's a good idea to assume. Actually, even THOSE two I am at this point becoming skeptical of. I am becoming INCREASINGLY aware that stuff is not as it seems. And I think that's what's bothering me here: Stuff isn't as it seems, and yet thinking that it is, or thinking that it is what one wants it to be... it's like... I worry it's inherently limiting. Like a cage.

I dunno. What I'm saying is, this kind of stuff we tell ourselves? Often bullshit and often keeps us down.

EP, you have a pretty high standard of what service we should all be doing.

Why exactly is performing the service of contributing on a forum so inadequate? In my opinion it is a fine service depending on the spirit it is done in. There are some contributors here who are especially consistent, generous with their time and attention, and are a source of love and light which comes through from their words. These people provide a comfort that is beyond the words on a screen. Their presence here is a comfort.

Please tell me why this service is so horribly inadequate. I don't see a lot of better examples of service in the general population. Most people consume media, they don't create much content of inspirational quality. And even then, who am I to say? Who am I to know the heart behind a task that is performed?

It is wonderful that these discussions are even occurring, that when I find breaks in my busy life I can join into conversations that feed aspects of my soul that aren't so easily looked at in ordinary life. Even your candid off-loading contributions inspire those darker aspects of the self which demands only that which is real. The degree of anonymity that this forum offers is a form of freedom not available in the life where bills must be paid.

Before we do good in this world, we must first stop doing harm. Before we save the world, we must put our immediate affairs in order first. The service we are doing right now IS the service we are best suited for, because it is by definition, the service that we do. That does not mean we cannot change. Nothing is permanent. But first, why not just focus on what you're now doing, and do it as well as you can.

Why do we continue to self-flagellate? What purpose does it serve?

I asked you if you knew me because the question itself is as ridiculous as summing up the whole contribution of one's life in a few off-hand statements. I am yet to know myself, who could know the conscious being behind an internet moniker? Nothing is truly known. I'm sorry to all here, I cannot confirm if anyone here is a wanderer, but if we're discussing the topic of STO, then why not discuss wanderers? I see so much desire here to do good in the world and insecurity of not being good enough. Well, you are all good enough, you always were and always will be. You can't bring me down from this high EP , it ain't gonna happen
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04-08-2020, 04:49 AM,
#21
RE: Is STO doing things?
@Phoenix

A few observations I would share:

Well, sure, you are not shouting. Because you are writing...

HOWEVER if you for the fucking sake of honesty ReAD what you WRITE, with ALL the CAPiTALS, with all the f***, s***, bullshit and so on, you MIGHT ReALiZE, that there IS quite a LOF of A G G R E S S I O N im your posts....

I dont think the original poster deserves that, he just asked a question.
And, yes, we all struggle.
We all get impatient with ourselves, for we seemingly endlessly repeat the same negative cycles over and over again.

Dont get me wrong, this is not about „freedom of speech“, this is not about lovey-dovey language only.
This is about someone entering a room and slapping everyone ´s face, which I dont find appropriate.
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04-08-2020, 05:03 AM,
#22
RE: Is STO doing things?
@Phoenix

It is not entirely clear, I you agree or disagree with the model of sts/sto in regards to the ego (there were so many „bullshits“ in your post that I lost track, which bullshit belongs to which statement).

I would note that this is just a model.
The weakness of the model is the understanding of „ego“ one might have.
If you add it to the sto/sts model being presented in the Ra material however, it worked quite well for me.

I will try to explain what I mean:

Many experiences and situations in life confront us with negative emotions in ourselves.
We can either allow those and go deeper within until we find an appropriate response. And most often this is about something that has to be healed in us.
Or we can try to control the (perceived) outer source of the negative emotion.

One options leads to healing more and more. It bit by bit renders automatic ego reactions unnecessary and helps us develop the ability to respond from „the heart“, from a deeper „I“.

The other options prevents us from ever healing and the only thing it does, is, reeinforcing the seperation from ourselves. This road leads to a way of responding to situations from the ego permanently.
It will permanently be a „me against you“ instead of „together we can solve our common problem“.
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04-08-2020, 05:11 AM,
#23
RE: Is STO doing things?
I would also add to the discussion:

The question is always in relation to the one asking it!

The question itself, on a level of words, can be interpreted in many ways. And so there are many different answer, seemingly contradicting.
I think however, the different answer actually answer different interpretations of the question.

So, in regards to the original question, I would offer a few questions in return:

Why are you so concerned with polarity?
Is this in regard to being havestable?
If so, do you want to be harvestable in order to get away from here?

Are you being honest to yourself?
You have been on the spiritual path for quite some time, and still, you are asking questions that I feel you already know the answer within you.
So why do you ask this question in the first place?
Dont you hear the answer when you listen within?

Why do you think your ability to serve is limited to sitting at home and sending love?
Why do you believe you cannot go out, connect with human beings just in a totally normal way?
Wouldnt it be absolutely natural to do so?
Why do you think you cant do this?
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04-08-2020, 05:49 AM,
#24
RE: Is STO doing things?
Not trying to bring you down from a high if you're onone. Go ahead and do ya damn thang do ya-thang-a-thang.

It's cool to discuss wanderers. I just don't want the assumption of being a wanderer becoming this thing that it tends to become for people: an ego trap and a caste system. and I DEFINITELY don't think it's good to point out the whole "just here to raise the frequency" thing because then people don't get motivated to push themselves.

It's not horrid or inadequate to do whatever, but I do feel people generally tend to bullshit themselves.

"Why do I have such high standards?"

Are my standards REALLY that high? Or is it just that we've been programmed to keep our standards for service so low that we remain trapped in the proverbial "matrix"?

Better than basically just consuming all day sounds like an INCREDIBLY low bar. And I think the bar got that low because we've been programmed twith all kinds of bullshit, but I don't think the idea that posting on an internet forum is really this giant service is any more truthful. Those diligent forum members you speak of PROBABLY DO OTHER STUFF and are probably so diligent because they have CULTIVATED DILIGENCE, which the elite LHP orders DO NOT want us cultivating. Yes, they deliberately create unrealistic lifestyle expectations to mess us up, but is thinking we can do more than posting on a forum REALLY one of those unrealistic lifestyle expectations?

From what I can tell, graduation from this planet (since the LoO material stresses the importance of it so much) has been historically QUITe difficult. Polarization is about recognizing one's true Will. Is posting on an internet forum REALLY the summation of anyone's true Will? If so, by all means post away and don't let me discourage you. Otherwise, I suggest being real with oneself about it. The elite LHP orders may utilize unrealistic lifestyle expectations to keep us down, but on the flip side, they also utilize another thing to keep us down: complacency. If Posting on a forum is REALLY the summation of one's Will, DO IT WITH ALL YOU GOT. All I'm saying is BE HONEST. Because if it's not, and it's just complacency, again, not judging or throwing stones from that glass house, but I think it would be a DISSERVICE not to call a spade a spade.

When it comes to the whole "Not enough" thing, I agree that mentality is a big problem in the world, but so is the quiet desperation and suffering born of the complacency that has people yearning within to do more, but settling for less than the best from themselves due to whatever bullshit they tell themselves. and so when there's a notion that sets off my BS detectors I think "Well, this could just breed complacency"

One does not need to be complacent to be happy, nor does not being complacent mean one is not capable of being satisfied with oneself until one becomes Tony Stark or something. I think it's just one of those things though where there's a line between the false voice that says "You're never enough, no matter what you do" and the true voice that says "There is something I yearn to do and being complacent won't help me figure out what it is"

I think conflating the two is just as distorted, personally. It's good to not give into the first one, but I think ignoring the second voice causes us to miss opportunities for service, and therefor polarization.

I'm not disagreeing with the notion that dilligent posting on these forums can be a service. I am expressing skepticism that it is the true pinnacle of anybody's REAL desire for service to limit their service to a forum on the internet, just because that seems more servicable than smoking weed, getting laid, going to a job one hates and playing videogames and watching anime all day or something, like a lot of people do.

But you're right, nothing is truly known.

I don't know another's Will.

But it seems FEW know THEIR OWN Will, and basically, all I'm saying is BE HONEST about it. If posting on an internet forum is one's true Will, by all means, fulfill your true Will.

But if it's not, don't lie to yourself about it and say it is, is all I'm saying. That doesn't mean to feel like s*** though about it if that's what one is doing. Remember, I acknowledged the value of being patient with oneself. The virtue of forbearance makes for what is in my opinion a better alternative to either complacency with less than one truly desires to do inside on one hand, and unrealistic lifestyle expectations where nothing one does is ever enough on the other.

Then, even when one is doing little, yet yearning to do a lot, on can be free from the burdens of both complacency AND the feeling of inadequacy. It becomes the sense that one is just moving at their own speed, but that they ARE moving towards something and they are self aware enough not to be complcaent with where they are.

I think it's good we can clarify here, because I don't necessarily want to poopoo spending a lot of time on this site, nor necessarily shame anybody. At the same time, there are A LOT of excuses we make to stay complacent and not move forward, even if at a slow pace. Those excuses can be couched in QUITE the air of positivity, and I see that as something to be on gaurd against. Still, refining one's understanding between complacency and excuses vs. inadequacy and shame is a good exercise I would highly encourage.

Move at your own pace, but make sure you're moving forward and make sure your HONEST about how and where you're moving (or NOT moving to) is basically what I would like to clarify my position and advocate.

Thank you for helping me to refine my point.

I hope all is well and I do not intend for anybody reading my posts to feel inadequate. Rather, my hope is for them to simply KEEP IT REAL with themselves. It's true that really, nobody can know one better than oneself can. That being said, nothing wrong with stressing honesty and refusing to enable self deception if one thinks it might be going on. But you're right. Far be it from me to be the arbiter of anybody's true Will but my own.

So perhaps it IS one's highest service to post on a frum. Pardon me though for my skepticism.
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Black Dragon
04-08-2020, 06:44 AM,
#25
RE: Is STO doing things?
A notion on being honest to oneself:

I believe this is of utmost importance when we want to evolve.
But just setting the standards of honesty extremely high and then on the other hand relying on even more self-betrayal to meet those standards doesnt do any good.

You never know why a person takes so long to resolve a given issue, you never know what is behind, unless you finally healed it (if there is such a thing as a final healing of an issue).
Lying to oneself to a degree is a necessity to a certain degree, I would not judge it, but rather observe it, realize it and hopefully bit by bit overcome it.

You know, I have done massive amounts of inner journeys, facing very challenging stuff and also healing a lot of it. I have seen what resembles hell for me countless times, not only seen, but experienced.

Still, as I am writing this, I am smoking a cigarette.
Can you believe that?
It seems I cannot even face the withdrawel symptoms although I have faced so many hells.
Does this make me a less worthy human being?

I dont think so, it just makes me an idiot like anybody else!
So, what the heck, we all are doing our best to stumble through life, no one can ever know what the obstacles truly are for somebody else, we dont even understand our stuff.

Why not be a stumbling idiot? Whats wrong with that?
Wink
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EvolvingPhoenix
04-08-2020, 10:50 AM, (This post was last modified: 04-08-2020, 10:52 AM by Great Central Sun.)
#26
RE: Is STO doing things?
I'm not saying that I just sit here and send love. I do other things like take my mom to her appointments and get groceries.
I serve my dog by taking care of him, feeding him and such.
I offer advice and teach on a Patreon site. Though just started so don't have anyone there yet.

But I do work on myself the most. Like with a lot of meditation.

I serve when I can. I just don't go out of my way to serve at a soup kitchen or that sort of thing.
You have to do what resonates with you, and what you love.

I asked because Ra said you need to be STO 51%, so I thought that might mean that 12 hours a day (1/2 the day) have to be actively serving others.
Of course, if I repeat 3D I'm not upset. But I don't think it's a bad thing to want to harvest.

Doubt everything. Find your own light. - Buddha
https://www.intentionrepeater.com
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04-08-2020, 12:14 PM,
#27
RE: Is STO doing things?
That's cool Gem. Yeah that's fine. Meditation is great. My advice is this: focus on self healing. It is the thing which is most likely to polarize you in the positive. You don't need to go to a soup kitchen. And I'm not saying you only spend time on your computer and send love, but rather, you asked if you have to do anything and her answer seemed like it was saying to me that if that's all you do, it's enough to polarize, and I don't think so. It's not just you I don't want to get it twisted. Who knows who else might read this and think "Oh, well, as long as I go on b4 and feel positive feelings" you know? I just don't like the idea. Don't worry, I'm sure your fine. You don't need to be busting your ass to serve people, but I DO think healing is the most important thing. Chances are, if you heal your lower 3 chakras, you will find your Will to do even more. From what I can tell, there is an advanced and complex magickal system at play for vampyrically draining us of our prana and leaving us in a disempowered state. So I feel like it's REALLY important we do what we can to heal and revitalize ourselves. Chakra work is my focus, along with physical fitness lately. Mostly calisthenics. Meditation is good too. Those things might seem small, but they are great ways to heal the root chakra. I also recommend Chi Gong. Another post on here talks about that. Give it a read if you haven't already. I intend to incorporate that. Sounds useful!

Just focus on clearing your lower chakras Gem. Most efficient way to polarize and heal the world by healing yourself. The inherent oneness of all things means it WILL have a greater effect on the mass consciousness. Great way to be of service. No soup kitchens required Wink
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Great Central Sun
04-08-2020, 12:24 PM,
#28
RE: Is STO doing things?
I agree EP. I realized that when I opened to Intelligent Infinity (just a little), that my lower 2 chakras were still a little weak.
So I've focused on strengthening them.
I want the Intelligent Infinity from above to balance the Kundalini from below and meet in my heart.
I found that when I balanced my lower half, that the Intelligent Infinity wasn't so strong and dense.
It was slowed down and more balanced.
Now I am connecting to the Pleiadians.
I like their love. It's a distortion from pure Intelligent Infinity, thus is more personable. I feel I can identify with the Pleiadians more
than Intelligent Infinity.
I do have to work on myself before I can help others as much as I'd like to.

Doubt everything. Find your own light. - Buddha
https://www.intentionrepeater.com
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04-08-2020, 01:30 PM, (This post was last modified: 04-08-2020, 01:41 PM by Luigi.)
#29
RE: Is STO doing things?
The 51%-49% thing; it's a balance of serving others and the self, right?. It seems, to me, to be about the following of the heart and the love within the moment, and then the service follows naturally. The magic starts within.

There was useful info given from Q'uo here:
Quote:(https://www.llresearch.org/transcripts/issues/2009/2009_1003.aspx)
We are those of Q’uo. The attempt that a servant of the light makes to be of service allows that servant to discover things about him or herself. It allows that being to come across those dirty fingerprints on the window that cast shadows when the sun tries pass through them. Each of those dirty fingerprints has to be attended to. And it is only by placing yourself in the light and desiring to have the light come through you that those flecks of dirt and fingerprints and grime can be discerned. It is a gift to the self when one wishes to be of service, thus fulfilling the paradox spoken of earlier.

Let us speak about the fingerprint on the window that is called fear. In effect each fingerprint could be labeled fear because fear is the opposite of love. When this instrument, in the example spoken of in the question posed in this group, chose to give the possession of her ring to whichever homeless person or beggar in her city asked of her for the value of money, she discovered that place of fear within her: that fear of being approached, of looking into the eyes of another self and being asked for something that she could not give or did not feel that she had the right to give. [1] When she carried that ring with her with the intention of giving it away, the fear lifted. And in that lifting of the fear a connection of love which was made because she could look in the eye of everyone that passed her, knowing that she could be of service when service was asked of her.

When the fear is no longer there between two selves, there does the light flow between Creator and Creator. There is no longer a holding that traps energy. The energy flows more freely through the chakras, specifically orange and yellow, those chakras that deal with society and the interactions with another self. In giving of things of which the self has possession, one gives of the self and allows those blockages to be released, because there is no longer a blockage between Creator and Creator.

Although the act of generosity was not performed by giving this ring, the desire to give and be of service was what helped this seeker find a blockage and release it, which is the only purpose that was necessary, the act of giving being much less relevant than the gift of love that was created and the discovery of a blockage to that love.

It has been said by this instrument’s teacher and those of the Confederation to look for love in all situations. In working with the self in these subtle arts, it is just as helpful to look for the fear. Why are you afraid? Why is the love seemingly absent? What are the remedies for the self for making this fear or blocking this love?...

Quote:(https://www.llresearch.org/transcripts/issues/2009/2009_1003.aspx)
...The acting out of service or what your society conceives of as service, we propose to you, is much less important. For one works on the self. One always works on the self. And when one works on the self, the inner self, the outer situations take care of themselves. We propose to this group to put less energy into worrying about performing those acts you each consider to be of service and put those energies of worry into being thankful for the service you each now already perform.

Your society holds up as models those people whom you each consider to have been model servants of the light. Mohandas [2], the one known as Jesus, and the one known as Martin [3] gave tremendously of themselves, to the point of giving their own lives. Many peoples of your planet have in the past worn bracelets or some such reminder with the inscription “WWJD,” asking of themselves, “What would Jesus do in this or that situation?” Each of these people did not say to themselves, “What should I do?” “What is the thing that is of service?” They just did the service.

How is this possible? How does one know what the right service is? We say to you that this is an unskilled question. The skilled question is to find the love and the service will follow. When the heart is open to the extent it was open in the three individuals mentioned, there are no questions of what is of service. There is merely service. The heart leads the way. The faithful servant follows. And the love appears. The light shines through.

When you ask what would be of service you are removing faith, [and instead] you are using the intellect to replace your faith. You are not moving love but trying to emulate love. One can try to cultivate love, but we would suggest in the way we see it that this is a temporary result, perhaps an inspiring model but not the end result, not a permanent objective. Love cannot be cultivated by will or logic. Love is cultivated by allowing it to accumulate naturally as the seeker continues to seek, continues to give thanks, and continues to point his or herself ever toward the light.

In this way love arises naturally. And when love arises naturally and fills the heart, and the mind lets go of its judgments and turns itself over to faith and true service is performed, this is not easy. It is not something one can achieve by practicing this or that skill, but that which will come as it will; come with patience and dedication to the task of being a servant of the light.
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04-08-2020, 03:54 PM,
#30
RE: Is STO doing things?
@ Luigi
I think 51% positive as a requirement for harvest pointing to a „balance“ is an interpretation.
I dont think its about achieving a „balance“ of sto and sts.

I would say, it rather points to the fact that its really hard to cut down service to self to 49% even for a positive entity.
This would further point to the fact (or assumption) that the „starting point“ for all of us is way more on the sts side then we might think.

Sts doesnt mean I do something thats good for me.
But I expressed my views on that in the posts above.

Theres something wrong with my account technically, because of that my post need to be approved manually. so my post have a delay of a few hours and are a bit out of sequence (in regards to the discussion) I apologize for that!
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