2006.01.01 'Failure' of the plan that this logos chose

[unity100]

To me, this suggests that the Logos's plan has been successful, since it has succeeded in creating a vivid creation.

a vivid creation which has given only 250something 4d graduates out of 7 billion and more (counting the maldek, deneb, earth populations) since the last 705,000 years, destroying 2 3d habitation environments. it is possible that there have been more harvested during the period, however, there hasnt been any societal complex grade harvests up till this point. had earth also been destroyed, there wouldnt be any place in this solar system until mars would get rehabilitated (if it can, in the meaningful time) or, pluton gets through 1d, goes to 2d, and goes to 3d. even at that point there wouldnt be any noticeable scale 4d harvests. that would be a very, very long time.

considering the 4d cycle is 30 million years, as Ra says, and pluton would take billions to pass through 1-2d, that would mean that if mars didnt get rehabilitated and start putting out graduates, 4d inhabitants of this solar system would graduate. that means, apart from who was sent to other planets and gets harvested there, and returns to this planet (unlikely, since it seems entities that complete a 3d in a planet that passes to 4d seem to stay there, and entities that get harvested before a planet gets to 4d again are likely to stay there to serve), there wouldnt be any native graduates of this logos to 4d, in its natural way.

that means, there would be a huge time period in which this logos wouldnt be having its own biases, preferences and the facets of existence it was set to discover, represented in 4d vibrations. infinite intelligence is discovering infinite numbers of its aspects through being multiple finites. if a finite fails to discover its own aspects, it becomes an aspect undiscovered. if a finite gets stalled in its discovery, it constitues a failure, imbalance, mishap, or error.

of course, totally leaving out the fact that, had this planet been blasted, there wouldnt be any other planet which would manifest such a 'vivid' 3d manifestation for a long time.

Here is what you wrote. It looks to me like you're saying the negatives destroyed Maldek and Atlantis.

in my opinion, the 'negative' polarity, something which actually, logically can not exist and be valid (because nothing can ever strive to be infinite to express the infinity of existence of all of us), needs to be abolished. and i am assuming, it will be abolished.

imagine - they destroyed a planet here (maldek). they have come here, and then created another catastrophe. (atlantis).

maldek entities had negatively inclined entities among them. actually even this planetary population still has them. the above bit's first paragraph is talks about the negative polarization concept, the second is roughly related to it. maybe i shouldnt have grouped those two one after another, or, the second paragraph should have been expanded in order to signify the difference. the link in between two is that, when negative and positive inclined entities mix in 3d, the result becomes more than a simple mix of 3d entities, especially when technology comes into the mix.

Yes, of course, and so are you. Let's say we're wanderers; we could easily have left earth to its own devices, to succeed or fail on its own merits. If we're not wanderers, well, it's a big universe. There are lots of other places we could have learned third-density lessons. And we didn't need to choose manifestation at all:

[quote='1.5']This distortion is not in any case necessary. It is chosen by each of you as an alternative to understanding the complete unity of thought which binds all things.

firstly, if we are wanderers, we wouldnt need to learn 3rd density lessons. we cannot make a choice again. it is possible to say that this can be a facility for learning wisdom lessons, and that is plausible.

however, there is this - if we have chosen to fail the earth on its own merits, it would probably mean the obliteration of a huge percentage of the population, or, destruction of the planet and 7 billion + entities going into a state like maldek entities have gone into, for a 'very long time' (we dont know how long did it take).

totally leaving aside the fact that allowing 7 billion entities (approx only 4 of them are natives of this logos, 3 billion seems to be from other places) to get devastated would be a lack of compassion, it would be a huge pain, a spasm, a shock, a trauma in some parts or majority of this galaxy, if that happened. '7 billion souls cried in agony', and in an instant. since all of existence is connected, and thought travels even faster than light (probably instant), this pain, shock, agony would be felt a lot, and we wouldnt know what it would lead to, in regard to time/space consequences.

then again there is also the call and attraction issues. they are in distress, subconsciously calls go out, and it needs to be obeyed. the ones which obey them, 'with their own free will' are the ones whose development and 'galactic' karmic models require them to obey and make them suitable to obey.

so, its not just a 'hey, let me heed this call' choice. it is probably the most strong probability vortex standing in front of us, when we were making a choice. choosing any other would be harder, depending on the strength of other vortexes.

[quote][quote]Veiling third density isn't taking it out.

the extreme example illustrates the illogicality and lack of wisdom of clogging the natural and free flow of creation's energies. it requires effort to miss the core of the example.

Are you saying I'm trying to be obtuse? I assure you that's not the case.[/quote]

you are not providing logic, reasoning behind your arguments. therefore, it becomes rather harder to discuss, and also it becomes unfruitful for the person in front of you, because you dont bring reasons and ideas, it doesnt stimulate thought in the mind of the other person.

it boils down to responding to one liner statements, which were not articulated or argumentated.

[quote]the 'illusion' you are talking about the 'reality' the infinite intelligence was able to discover.

No, it's the creation our Logos has built for the Creator to experience Itself within.[/quote]

we seem to be having a context difference here. when i speak of 'illusion', im speaking of this ENTIRE existence, manifestation, not only this octave, but also all the other octaves.

[quote]infinite numbers of finites actually constituting an infinite entity, does not make the finite parts of that entity, that entity itself.

According to Ra, each seemingly finite part is in fact the infinite entity itself. That's what the quote re: holographs below is saying.[/quote]

despite i have explained that quote to you, i will drop another pointer here in that regard :

if, any finite entity was the infinity itself, there wouldnt be any need to have more than such 'infinite' finite entities.

it would take only 1 entity to manifest, and discover itself, for entire infinity to discover itself.

the very fact that there exists more than 1 finite entity that is actually 'infinite', means that a single finite entity which 'actually' being infinite would not suffice.

that means, a single finite entity is not replaceable for infinity itself.

No, you are infinite right now.

that is the kind of sentences im talking about. there is nothing to respond here, or to talk, or to articulate, or to do anything. nothing that can be used. the only thing that can be responded to is 'no, you are finite', and it would resemble more a bickering than a fruitful discussion.

Actually, their harvest from third density was only six and a half million. But of course, their numbers could have grown since then.

yes, their numbers, have grown.

I think the need for fifth- and sixth-density wanderers may have more to do with the misguided actions by those formerly known as Yahweh in the transfer of souls from Maldek than with the Logos's plan.

while this in itself is another angle and a whole topic in itself, with a high probability, there is also the important consideration about yahweh - what was it that caused them to act this way - getting attached to a certain group of 3d entities with illogical compassion to the point of repeatedly causing the same mistakes over and over. all of the mistakes involve 3d entities, and technology, and its ramifications, blended with unwise levels of compassion and tolerance. it can easily be suspected that, their story also is a result of the general plan of this logos. but again, this is a long topic.

Actually, in Dewey Larson physics, the natural or undistorted state is flowing outward from all locations. It's not still.

yes it is. however, it is the point where dewey's physics start. it is, as Ra states, the opening stages of this understanding, however it is suitable and acceptably advanced for earth civilization here.

as you can understand from here, im not basing the explanation of infinity entirely on dewey's physics. it is very useful for explaining various parts of it.

[quote]http://bring4th.org/forums/showthread.php?tid=1143&pid=14843#pid14843
http://bring4th.org/forums/showthread.php?tid=1272

If I have time...However, at a quick glance I did notice one thing that seems fundamentally at odds with Ra's description of infinity:

there cant be 'one' entity in infinity. ie, there cant be singleness in infinity.

because for infinity to happen, it needs to be infinite in all respects. being 'one' or 'single' are concepts that are being related to finity, which becomes valid for any entity that is a subset of infinity, therefore finite. it cannot pass valid when infinity is contemplated.

That which is infinite cannot be many, for many-ness is a finite concept. To have infinity you must identify or define the infinity as unity; otherwise, the term does not have any referent or meaning. In an Infinite Creator there is only unity.

Maybe you already addressed this in that thread or another, but your statement seems hard to reconcile with Ra's.[/quote]

there is nothing to reconcile - i dont agree with Ra at that :

during the courses of harmonizations, infinite entities harmonizing to a great extent that, seeming to act like a single entity to an outside observer, hides the fact that that harmonized, singular looking entity in fact comprises of infinite numbers of entities, or aspects.

this is the very reason that, this singular looking entity is discovering infinite aspects of itself in an infinite creation ; it has infinite numbers of aspects, facets, within.

I think this is the crux of the issue, and I think you are misreading Ra's answer. "As in a holographic picture" means in the same way that each part of a holographic picture contains the whole, so do we. It doesn't mean that we carry a picture of the Creator. It means that we contain the Creator.

had it been such, there would be no need for more than one entity to manifest. because, it would contain all the creator, and discovery of that singular entity would mean that all was discovered. there wouldnt be any need for infinite numbers of such holographic pictures to exist, because, none of them would be different, since they all would be containing the infinity in the same way infinity itself is. one discovery would be enough.

the possibility of every such entity being infinite towards its inwards, does not mean that they also encompass the others. there are other such 'infinite' finite entities aside from you, and their numbers are infinite. that means, infinite numbers of finite entities make up infinity. and one 'infinite' finite entity, cannot replace for all of it.

I think the key is awareness. Ra said infinity became aware. Unaware infinity may be complete and perfect, with nothing needing to be done, but aware infinity decided to investigate finity. Not because it needed to, just because it wanted to.

'unaware' infinity is not a possibility, because, for infinity to be infinity, it also needs to encompass the concepts 'aware' and 'unaware'. because otherwise, it wouldnt be infinity.

so, anything that is different from the state of infinity, becomes a subset of infinity.

But according to Ra, that's exactly what happened. Infinity became aware, and Infinite Intelligence determined to investigate a concept it discerned.

please refer to the above block.

I think this is an assumption on your part. The infinite is not still in Dewey Larson's physics, and it's not still in Ra's cosmology, at least not once it becomes aware.

i have noted that i am not basing all my thoughts on dewey, also, im not agreeing with Ra in everything.

[quote]if you are infinite whole, please project yourself to our space/time continuum that is to come 2 octaves later than this particular octave's creation we are experiencing, and bring us information from there.

the entity who penetrates intelligent infinity is basically capable of walking the universe with unfettered tread.

if you cant, it means you are not infinite.

Not at all; it just means I haven't penetrated intelligent infinity in a systematic and reproducible way in this incarnation yet.[/quote]

that means, you do not even encompass the state of you which has penetrated intelligent infinity in a systematic and reproducible way in your current incarnation.

therefore, there are things you are not able to encompass, therefore, you are finite.

[quote]had you been infinite, you wouldnt even have the need to project yourself actually, you wouldnt be even here, interacting through a computer screen.

Why not? It's how I choose to amuse myself at this point in time.
[/quote]

had you been infinity, you wouldnt choose to amuse yourself, because, you would already contain your amused, and unamused states, not to mention that you would have chosen everything all at the same time ; including choosing not to amuse yourself.

however, you do not. you still make choices, there are still 'choices' you can make. of course, if we take 'choice' as an explanation for not containing any of the above concepts/states within yourself in a manifesting and total manner.

in actuality, you do not encompass, contain those concepts, aspects, or states. hence, you are finite.