Abrupt vs gradual harvest

[Siren]

When someone dies, does their influence on the planetary vibrations stop?

By "dying" I suppose you mean leaving the current 3rd density space/time continuum. If so, it is my understanding that the "dead," or discarnate, entities residing within this sphere's inner planes (time/space) do influence the planetary vibrations to some degree. It is only when an entity is in some way relocated, transplanted or otherwise removed from the planetary locus (from both its space/time and time/space) that, generally-speaking, the influence would no longer hold sway.

This is an oversimplification, of course, as the mechanics are somewhat more complex.

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EDIT: I think I may have misunderstood your question in the first place, so I readjusted the answer upon second review.

[AnthroHeart]

I imagine the mechanics are more complex. We incarnated for a reason, to increase the vibration of the planet. Something we couldn't do from time/space evidently.

[zenmaster]

When someone dies, does their influence on the planetary vibrations stop?

There would no longer be a m/b/s complex or experiential nexus shared with the planet and individuals - the pattern offered by the body supports that. To some extent these patterns can be willed, but not for long after death. That's the whole point of incarnation in the first place - to access this nexus.

[Parsons]

Ok, the web browser on my phone keeps screwing up and posts in the wrong thread. Ignore this post, mispost.

[Peregrinus]

The harvest will continue to occur over the next 100+ years. 3D physicals vehicle will "die" according to the disincarnate contract agreed upon. If one was born with a 3D/4D duel activated body, the vehicle will look the same, but will be very different in all other respects, and it may remain for the unveiling of Mother Earth's 4D physical vehicle (100+ years). Anyone that wants to "take their 3D body with them", does so out of fear.

[Tenet Nosce]

I see this thread is still going round and round!

I came across this compilation of quotes from "Archangel Michael". Some interesting views here that may help in reconciling the seeming conflicts. Also, I point out these quotes are about "Ascension" and not "Harvest". They are not exactly the same concept, as I'm sure any L/L student would know. But anyway... some food for thought...

What Will Ascension be Like? – Part 1/2

[AnthroHeart]

Thanks Tenet. It's too bad that part 2/2 doesn't seem to exist.

[Patrick]

Thanks Tenet. It's too bad that part 2/2 doesn't seem to exist.

...yet.

[zenmaster]

some food for thought...

What Will Ascension be Like? – Part 1/2

The harvest where people want people to disappear. I guess that solves some kind of unconscious need.

[Patrick]

some food for thought...

What Will Ascension be Like? – Part 1/2

The harvest where people want people to disappear. I guess that solves some kind of unconscious need.

Will People Disappear from Third-Dimensionality?

AAM: Let us be very clear, people will disappear. Now, in conjunction with that, they will also become a dim memory...

<sigh>

Zero resonance from me. But Linda lost me with the space trip a couple months ago anyway.

[Tenet Nosce]

some food for thought...

What Will Ascension be Like? – Part 1/2

The harvest where people want people to disappear. I guess that solves some kind of unconscious need.

Will People Disappear from Third-Dimensionality?

AAM: Let us be very clear, people will disappear. Now, in conjunction with that, they will also become a dim memory...

<sigh>

Zero resonance from me. But Linda lost me with the space trip a couple months ago anyway.

Eh? Are you guys referring to something from Part 2? Haven't read it yet... but will now.

---

Ah, now I see what you are referring to. Well, we will all see soon enough, won't we?

I will say that claim doesn't quite offend my sensibilities. I don't really understand it either. But I have noticed as of late more than one dream experience where different characters appear (or disappear) from my memory as I access it in the dream, and I don't seem to notice any change until after I awakened.

For example, some people who play a large role in my waking life do not make an appearance in my dream states, and while I am in them, I do not remember that they even existed.

Similarly, people appear in my dream state who I do not know in my waking state, yet I have previous memories of them while I am dreaming, as if I have known them all along.

Another thing- I know that when I was very very young I had memories of some life that came before this one. I also knew that those memories would fade away, and that there was nothing that I could do about it. Although I promised to myself that I would at least remember that "something" came before this life. Which I did.

Finally- in consideration of the hypnotic trance that most people, particularly Americans, live in today, I wouldn't rule out some kind of drastic change happening without them even noticing, or perhaps even convincing themselves that was how things were all along. Actually, in many ways, this sort of thing is what we are now witnessing before our very eyes.

So in consideration of all these, I don't see this claim as being so farfetched. Although I hold it with the same degree of skepticism as any other claim about "Harvest" or "Ascension". Only time will tell. But in the interest of discussion, I would be curious to hear more reasoning why this can't be true, other than simply being dismissive toward it.

[AnthroHeart]

Will People Disappear from Third-Dimensionality?

AAM: Let us be very clear, people will disappear. Now, in conjunction with that, they will also become a dim memory...

<sigh>

Zero resonance from me. But Linda lost me with the space trip a couple months ago anyway.

I must have missed that part.

[Gribbons]

Space trip?

This didn't particularly resonate with me as well, but in a sense it kind of did, if only because I watched a Twilight Zone episode last night where there were originally 3 astronauts that went up into space, disappeared for 24 hours and then reappeared, except no one remembers one of them except his best friend that went up. So all the newspapers essentially were rewritten, or went to another parallel universe where Ed Harrington did not exist except in the memory of his best friend, who went insane before telling the only other one who went up with him, who also did not remember Ed Harrington. Then that guy disappeared, and the only guy left went insane and the newspapers said he was the lone astronaut returner...

sooo....

we're really gettin' down to it with only a little more than 2 months to go, or shorter quite possibly, individually, according to part 2.

but being erased from existence and memory... blows me away. surely the creation is perfect, and such a process would be, idk, understandably inconvenient and to an extent disrespectful to the ascending soul who would, by leaving, leave their family and loved ones to a universe where they did not exist.

or am i missing something.. just seems there's a consistency lapse. and it's not cool as far as i can imagine at right now.

however, i did come onto the board today to discuss this very topic as I just read part 2 just over an hour ago, and here it is, already being discussed. haha

[AnthroHeart]

If there is a sudden shift into 4D, it'll be pretty epic. Even if the shift were spread out over 2 months, that's pretty phenomenal pace.

[xise]

Space trip?

This didn't particularly resonate with me as well, but in a sense it kind of did, if only because I watched a Twilight Zone episode last night where there were originally 3 astronauts that went up into space, disappeared for 24 hours and then reappeared, except no one remembers one of them except his best friend that went up. So all the newspapers essentially were rewritten, or went to another parallel universe where Ed Harrington did not exist except in the memory of his best friend, who went insane before telling the only other one who went up with him, who also did not remember Ed Harrington. Then that guy disappeared, and the only guy left went insane and the newspapers said he was the lone astronaut returner...

sooo....

we're really gettin' down to it with only a little more than 2 months to go, or shorter quite possibly, individually, according to part 2.

but being erased from existence and memory... blows me away. surely the creation is perfect, and such a process would be, idk, understandably inconvenient and to an extent disrespectful to the ascending soul who would, by leaving, leave their family and loved ones to a universe where they did not exist.

or am i missing something.. just seems there's a consistency lapse. and it's not cool as far as i can imagine at right now.

however, i did come onto the board today to discuss this very topic as I just read part 2 just over an hour ago, and here it is, already being discussed. haha

I've always felt quantum mechanics, manifestation, and parallel timelines are interrelated. Some part inside of me tells me that there are infinite parallel existences of us where we used our free will in different ways to create a different universe. I've always felt that deja vu / amnesia was the marking of intersecting timelines or a flag that your conciousness was slipstreaming into another timeline.

So for me, the whole forgetting thing seems like it could work.

Something just occured to me: I suspect that may also account for the fact that the shift may be both gradual and sudden in the same reality - gradual for those who do not penetrate the forgetting and sudden for those who remember the disappearances. You know I actually had a dream precisely on this type of harvest scenario months ago (check the dream thread). I had forgotten about it until now. Interesting.

[Parsons]

I just finished all the Q'uo material/all L/L channeled material after the Ra contact. I decided to give the Ra material one last read and got up to session 6 before noticing the quote that originally made me believe 2012 would be the culmination/end time of harvest and after which further 3D lessons would begin. This has even further reinforced my belief in an 'abrupt' harvest event. Although, further reading in the Q'uo material coupled with subsequent questioning to the godwide_void "channel" has made me realize both viewpoints of abrupt and gradual are entirely valid subjectively. If you do not wish to leave at the harvest culmination event you will have the opportunity to stay with the 3D population in an un-interrupted continuance on to an Earth replica world(save for a brief ecstatic contact with intelligent infinity at the striking of the hour).

Supporting Ra quote(with the full understanding that Don was asking about the 3D population then switched to the planet; it doesn't matter, the 3d population needs to live on a 3D planet):

6.15 Questioner: What is the length, in our years, of one of these cycles?
Ra: One major cycle is approximately 25,000 of your years. There are three cycles of this nature during which those who have progressed may be harvested at the end of three major cycles. That is, approximately between 75 and 76,000 of your years. All are harvested regardless of their progress, for during that time the planet itself has moved through the useful part of that dimension and begins to cease being useful for the lower levels of vibration within that density.

6.16 Questioner: What is the position of this planet with respect to the progression of cycles at this time?
Ra: I am Ra. This sphere is at this time in fourth-dimension vibration. Its material is quite confused due to the society memory complexes embedded in its consciousness. It has not made an easy transition to the vibrations which beckon. Therefore, it will be fetched with some inconvenience.

6.17 Questioner: Is this inconvenience imminent within a few years?
Ra: I am Ra. This inconvenience, or disharmonious vibratory complex, has begun several of your years in the past. It shall continue unabated for a period of approximately three oh, thirty, of your years.

6.18 Questioner: After this period of thirty years I am assuming that this will be a fourth-density planet. Is this correct?
Ra: I am Ra. This is so.

9.3 Questioner: The way that I understand the process of evolution is that our planetary population has a certain amount of time to progress. This is generally divided into three 25,000-year cycles. At the end of 75,000 years the planet progresses itself. What caused this situation to come about with the preciseness of the years in each cycle?
Ra: I am Ra. Visualize, if you will, the particular energy which, outward flowing and inward coagulating, formed the tiny realm of the creation governed by your Council of Saturn. Continue seeing the rhythm of this process. The living flow creates a rhythm which is as inevitable as one of your timepieces. Each of your planetary entities began the first cycle when the energy nexus was able in that environment to support such mind/body experiences. Thus, each of your planetary entities is on a different cyclical schedule as you might call it. The timing of these cycles is a measurement equal to a portion of intelligent energy.

This intelligent energy offers a type of clock. The cycles move as precisely as a clock strikes your hour. Thus, the gateway from intelligent energy to intelligent infinity opens regardless of circumstance on the striking of the hour.

Though ultimately, like many items of concern, unimportant, I'm nevertheless curious what your take is on the upcoming/ongoing transition of souls to fourth density.

Do you foresee a scenario whereby we "ascend" in a relatively short instance of our clock time? Releasing our physical, yellow-ray vehicles in a transfiguration of form and consciousness? If so, will this happen soonish?

If not, will our physical vehicles continue as they are until we are met with whatever sort of death third-density already had in store for us?
...

The moment of the vibrational shift remains set and marked in the approximate moments preceding, during, and following the onset of the winter solstice period of this year. Consciousness will be the primary constituent in the transition which will emulate the termination of physicality as it is currently known in this density of experience. Though the engulfing will be a global affection, the individual perception of the experience will be unique to each observer and coincide with personal expectation and orientation however the "destination" in the general sense will remain the same excluding those who will need to repeat the 3rd Density cycle of experience.
...

Is the length of time spent in 3rd density after the veil is lifted completely subjective to each entity experiencing 3rd density? Is this what Ra/Q'uo were referring to when they said there was going to be a transition period of some hundreds of years? Also, is this transition period still to occur if that is the case?

There will be no measurable time spent in 3rd density post-veil for the spectrum which this planet and its people will vibrate at is the 4th density, thus the 3rd density will be left behind for those who have graduated and there will essentially be no 3rd density for this planetary sphere or its residents. 3rd density experience will resume elsewhere for those who will need to remain situated in that density to complete their desired refinements decided prior to incarnation. The period of time mentioned following the shift refers entirely to the period of adjustment and the integration of revamped perceptual awareness which all affected by the shift will experience. The period of time does not denote the 4th density's gradual manifestation of being and native phenomenon and paradigms but simply means that not every individual consciousness will instantly be in complete mastery of their new form and its capabilities. This is true especially for those who are geared towards graduation but are entirely oblivious to the nature of the shift or had no prior predilection towards 'spirituality' during their 3rd density experience. Those who knew only the physical will need to learn how to harness what will be when they awaken to find themselves more 'etheric' in a sense.

[Patrick]

I'm not putting this here in support of either abrupt or gradual, but simply because it puts into words how I feel things are happening.

(source)

...As this energy becomes activated, you will find less and less influence of the Illuminati over your everyday affairs. At first not detectable by your masses, eventually someone will “test the waters” with an act known to be against the ways of the Illuminati and, in doing so, will find no resistance which otherwise would have been expected. This will embolden more to further “push the envelope” until it becomes apparent that the Illuminati, who none could actually see or discern but who knew were ever present, are no longer there, or if they are, are not adverse to the actions taken. As this knowledge becomes more widespread, more and more advances for the good of all mankind will begin to take shape on your world. As that occurs, you will see an ever increasing avalanche of human created movements unimpeded towards that which you all desire--to thrive, to be free, to explore, and be told and find the truth.

It will be a gradual occurrence and yet not gradual at all for decades and millennium will be wiped away in a seeming instant as your people realize they can lead a free existence unimpeded by the control of those who seek to enslave you. As scientists create technologies for the benefit of all and as these things make it to the mainstream and are not “shelved” by those who do not want you to have them, as the financial institutions cater to the needs of the people and not corporations, as politicians create fair and representative laws for all, slowly, but surely, you will see this new world develop...

What I have bolded is happening here right now in Québec. The truth is coming out all over the place and no one is trying to prevent the witnesses to testify. They are not bothered, no one is killing them or buying them or whatever. They reach the public commission just fine and then proceeds to spill the beans on almost all the corruption at all levels of the government with evidence in hands. Then you have the police proceeding with raids/arrests and mayors and ministers resigning or even arrested.

The mainstream believe it was about time a good cleanup like this happened and they don't even realize how special this truly is, but as far as I'm concerned I'm just flabbergasted that this is allowed to happen at all.

Since when does the Elites lets all the crap visibly fall on their heads like this without doing anything about it? Something good is really going on.

[zenmaster]

Since when does the Elites lets all the crap visibly fall on their heads like this without doing anything about it? Something good is really going on.

Or maybe it was "going on" all the time and no one bothered framing it this way until now.

[Parsons]

What will happen to our advanced 2D/chemical vehicles after the shift this December? Will we be inhabiting the appropriate density vehicle for 4D consciousness after that? Will these vehicles be upgraded to accommodate? And what will happen to the physical vehicles for the ones that are going to be repeating 3D?

The physical vehicle which the 3D human consciousness currently inhabits will be transmuted into the vessel which is most appropriately equipped to handle the less denser 4D spectrum of experience.

Sounds like the typical ascension idea, rather than harvest.

I make pretty much no distinction between the terms. i believe that there are numerous 'overbaked' concepts which people are splitting hairs over. Both words are commonly used to describe the transition from 3D to a higher density. It only serves to bog down the intellectual mind with long, heated discussions about separating these two concepts when there is no way to empirically prove your distinction between the terms.

Problem is that this is a rather long process of successive generations birthing "transitional bodies" which newly enter this realm as 4D.

I remember no specific Ra/Q'uo'tes which support this theory.

Further, the "4D spectrum of experience" is more dense, not less dense - and no, that's not a question of semantics.

Again, tamato, tomato, the persecutive differs but the end result is the same. It is very cute that you claim it is not a question of semantics when you are arguing semantics.

"Semantics (from Greek: sēmantiká, neuter plural of sēmantikós) is the study of meaning. It focuses on the relation between signifiers, such as words, phrases, signs, and symbols, and what they stand for, their denotata."

[Spaced]

The only thing I'm willing to say about the harvest is that I have no idea how it will work.

[Patrick]

The only thing I'm willing to say about the harvest is that I have no idea how it will work.

We will know after we died and this knowledge won't matter much then.

[reeay]

I often find it interesting how the topic is framed - "abrupt or gradual" and "abrupt vs gradual" as if it must be one or the other.

[Patrick]

I often find it interesting how the topic is framed - "abrupt or gradual" and "abrupt vs gradual" as if it must be one or the other.

Yep.

What would be cool is if in December the Guardians simply remove the quarantine around this planet.

I believe this would precipitate all other changes that we expect would come with harvest.

This might just happen. If this planet is going to 4d positive and it's already 4d in time/space. They could remove the quarantine. What do you think ?

[zenmaster]

The "ascension" idea doesn't fly (so to speak), as the new connection to 4D mind would remove the veil and all "wanderers" would instantly remember everything up to that point. This would be an "infringement". The dual-activated types may have more to work with past the "quantum leap" at the present time, but other than that it's birthing of the new body which will provide the "transfiguration" (for the 4D natives here). Awareness will continue to be filtered through the "genetic connections" from body (brain) to mind. Also, there will be a point, probably a few years down the road, where wanderers can not continue incarnating here, due to lack of 3D-only bodies.

---

This might just happen. If this planet is going to 4d positive and it's already 4d in time/space. They could remove the quarantine. What do you think ?

Would only make sense if people were no longer learning 3D lessons. Also, there probably was no quarantine on the 4D plane here, in the first place.

[Patrick]

...Would only make sense if people were no longer learning 3D lessons. Also, there probably was no quarantine on the 4D plane here, in the first place.

Why is that? Planets with an active 3d cycle are not normally quarantined. So I do not see why our quarantine would have to be in effect for much longer. (thread here about it)

[reeay]

Maybe this thread might be titled "ascension" vs harvest lol

[Spaced]

The only thing I'm willing to say about the harvest is that I have no idea how it will work.

We will know after we died and this knowledge won't matter much then.

It might prove useful if we decide to try and help out some 3D brothers at some future time

[zenmaster]

...Would only make sense if people were no longer learning 3D lessons. Also, there probably was no quarantine on the 4D plane here, in the first place.

Why is that? Planets with an active 3d cycle are not normally quarantined.

The native inhabitants are tended to by 4D+ or 4D-, or mixture depending on the polarity and strength of their "calling". Free-will is preserved. In the case of earth, the free-will was likely sacrificed in order to start 3D here from the start. Got both the natives and the transplants at vastly different points of 3D evolution. It sounds like an infringement of the other groups to have the transplants "speak" for the whole planet, which apparently they could do.

"The balancing is from dimension to dimension. The attempts of the so-called Crusaders to interfere with free will are acceptable upon the dimension of their understanding. However, the mind/body/spirit complexes of this dimension you call third form a dimension of free will which is not able to, shall we say, recognize in full, the distortions towards manipulation. Thus, in order to balance the dimensional variances in vibration, a quarantine was set up, this being a balancing situation whereby the free will of the Orion group is not stopped but given a challenge. Meanwhile, the third-density group is not hindered from free choice."

So I do not see why our quarantine would have to be in effect for much longer.

Like I said, the 3D development would be hindered. The last thing this planet needs are "landings".

[Sagittarius]

Zenmaster what do you mean by "It sounds like an infringement of the other groups to have the transplants "speak" for the whole planet, which apparently they could do" ?

Are you talking about the fact that if the transplants from a planet further into the 3d cycle penetrate the forgetting they could break free will of the natives?

[zenmaster]

Zenmaster what do you mean by "It sounds like an infringement of the other groups to have the transplants "speak" for the whole planet, which apparently they could do" ?

Functions according to the law of squares, correct? They share a subcollective mind. If they desire the 4D- info and assistance, as apparently is their tendency, that would necessarily involve the other groups at some point. (The 4D+ are also necessarily kept out to preserve free will.)

Are you talking about the fact that if the transplants from a planet further into the 3d cycle penetrate the forgetting they could break free will of the natives?

They are much more polarized, as a group due to 37,000 more years of 3D experience. Nothing really to do with polarizing that far (past forgetting), though.