Removing the veil of separation

[Margan]

...an anagram for veil is evil! [I just discovered that now, haha]...

Wow. I can't believe I never saw that before.

Evil is also "live" backwards.... so you could say the concept of "evil" is anti-life

[Ming the Merciful]

...an anagram for veil is evil! [I just discovered that now, haha]...

Wow. I can't believe I never saw that before.

Evil is also "live" backwards.... so you could say the concept of "evil" is anti-life

Good and Evil do not exist. They are different concepts of Mind. We can do inappropriate acts by hurting others causing a feelings of negativity. Although Positive and Negative actions are the perspective of how they are observed. The True Spiritual State is neutral. Within the Neutral State, concepts do not exist. Everything is an interpretation Mind, and the concept of an action.

[Patrick]

Hmm... Is removing the veil the same as moving into fourth density? I forgot to check that and was thinking of removing the veil while remaining in third density.

And also, there may be a separation process where those who move beyond the veil enter into another social sphere, still the same world yet separated by vibration.

The 3d veil is permeable and so we can pierce some of it. But actually removing the veil requires special authorization from the Council of 9 (otherwise removing the veil is the same as dying). For example Jesus had that authorization before the incarnation.

[Nikki]

...an anagram for veil is evil! [I just discovered that now, haha]...

Wow. I can't believe I never saw that before.

Evil is also "live" backwards.... so you could say the concept of "evil" is anti-life

Good and Evil do not exist. They are different concepts of Mind. We can do inappropriate acts by hurting others causing a feelings of negativity. Although Positive and Negative actions are the perspective of how they are observed. The True Spiritual State is neutral. Within the Neutral State, concepts do not exist. Everything is an interpretation Mind, and the concept of an action.

I have read your reply and ask if you, have ever experienced what is called evil or darkness? I would love to have a conversation with you regarding your post. In love and others can join in as well. It would be very interesting.

[Anders]

One observation is that it's possible to sense the vibrations from other people. We probably always do that, and that it's just that it's mostly a subconscious energy exchange.

Something a bit scary is that often I feel slightly uncomfortable vibrations. It's probably my own veil resonating with the veil of other people! So it's also a useful indicator of much of the veil still remains in oneself. The less veil the more harmonious vibrations I assume and with more practice the vibrations should become more peaceful.

[Anders]

It now struck me that ALL our emotions must be connected to everything. And because of the veil all our "compasses" point in different directions so it's difficult to find a balanced peaceful and unified ground.

It's even worse than that. I discovered that a vast majority of emotions and physical feelings in the body are numbed out. What a mess! The good thing is that if my guess is correct, learning how to become more conscious and awaken more feelings in oneself is a powerful tool for dissolving the veil.

[Anders]

Why do our feelings become numbed out? Because there is too much suffering in them, even physical pain. And I realized that the reason for that is because our separation-compasses point in different directions. So it's a mess of inner conflicts that needs to be numbed out or it would produce too much suffering.

The unity-compass overcomes the suffering by removing the conflicts that always result with our separation-compasses. And by having the intent to align one's separation-compass with the unity compass it allows for at least in theory a removal of the numbness and of the suffering that the numbness hides.

[Anders]

Removing the veil is NOT about self-sacrifice. It's not about becoming selfless. Sacrificing the self is the same as sacrificing everybody, since all are one. Selflessness is destructive.

To see selflessness as something to strive for is just a manipulation by collective egos, who themselves want to survive at the expense of the individuals making up those collective ego's. Self-sacrifice is service-to-self to the collective egos.

Instead removing the veil is about recognizing everybody as one. Where one is sacrificed, including oneself, everybody is sacrificed. So avoid the hype propaganda by the self-serving collective egos. And reject both self-sacrifice and selflessness. For the law is one.

[Anders]

Another problem with the veil is that it makes us think in terms of completely separate objects. My conclusion is that there are no separate objects in existence. Instead reality is made of only relations.

Reality is a web of relations and only that is my claim. Ra said that reality is thought, which is consistent with the idea of a web of relations since thoughts can be seen as patterns in that web.

It's useful to be able to deal with reality as having separate objects. The problem arises when we only think in terms of separate objects and miss the full interconnectedness of all things. Then we miss the mark, which is the meaning of the word 'sin' and a result of the veil.

[Anders]

The word "service" can sound tedious. Like something that requires a lot of effort and struggle. A way of recognizing that service can lead to less struggle is to use Ra's compass analogy again.

When we serve the unity-compass instead of our personal separation-compass, then we gain the immense power of the unity-compass. This means that if we remain only using our separation-compass, then that actually requires more effort and struggle since we then compete and clash with other people's separation-compasses all the time.

[Patrick]

Our very being is a service. When we meditate, we are serving. When we look up at the starry sky and find it beautiful, we are very much serving.

[Anders]

We cannot serve both God and money, it says in the Bible. What does serving money mean? I have written a lot about earlier. A new insight I have is that money is just a major example of the whole principle of experiencing reality as separate objects.

Money is extremely burdensome on our psyche. Why? Because it requires tremendous effort to uphold the function of money. Without our willing participation in the money 'scheme' it would have only little impact on us.

So "serving money" is to be trapped in experiencing separate objects. And "serving God" means the recognition of the interconnected of all things and how reality is one wholeness in motion instead of separate parts.

[Anders]

For example, in order for meditation to be effective I think the aim should be to relax the clunky separation-mind. Or else the meditation just becomes an additional occupation and after the meditation our minds revert back into burdensome separation-thinking.

Therefore my new view of 'meditation' is that it's about relaxing the separation-mind permanently rather than something done as a separate practice after which the mind immediately lapses back into its separation-thinking mischief caused by the veil.

[Patrick]

...Without our willing participation in the money 'scheme' it would have only little impact on us...

Yes indeed. This does not mean we stop using money right away. It means that when politicians comes along with proposals that would ultimately get rid of money, the collective has to vote for them. Otherwise, we are still giving our support towards the concept of money.

Most of humanity feels that money is a tool of STS, but still when it comes time to vote for change, that choice is not made and so people still worry about government spending and such. STS even managed to hijacked the spiritual community to fight against socialism. More socialism is what paves the way to eventually getting rid of money, but by making people believe that a true free market is the way to go instead, they delay the inevitable demise of the concept of money. It seems it is easy to forget that a true free market would still promote poor vs rich and not fix anything.

[Anders]

@Patrick Yes, I believe money will be replaced by other ways of making society work in the future, not least through accelerating progress of technology.

But also, "serving God" I see as including handling money. It's just that money then becomes on equal ground with the grass in the field so to speak and the air we breathe. So managing money then becomes an easy and peaceful activity even in today's world. That's my idea at least.

[Anders]

One interesting possibility is that the veil is mainly our thinking minds. Ra said that reality is thought. And that's all of reality! So for example an iPhone is a thought-structure at the fundamental level of reality.

This means that our thinking minds are a kind of second order form of thinking, maybe a bit like training wheels for the soul. And that it's possible to transcend ordinary thinking! Just like what for example spiritual teachers like Shunyamurti have talked about that there is the possibility of trans-conceptual awareness, meaning rising above ordinary thinking.

[Anders]

Actually, relaxing the thinking mind is a possible meditation technique. And I mean relaxing the thinking altogether! Not just as in a separate meditation session.

What do I mean by relaxing the thinking? I mean dropping thinking! May be an impossible approach, but I will test it. The idea is to stop relying on thinking even for everyday activities. So it's an extremely radical method.

[Nikki]

Actually, relaxing the thinking mind is a possible meditation technique. And I mean relaxing the thinking altogether! Not just as in a separate meditation session.

What do I mean by relaxing the thinking? I mean dropping thinking! May be an impossible approach, but I will test it. The idea is to stop relying on thinking even for everyday activities. So it's an extremely radical method.

The best way that I have found to stop the endless flow of thoughts is to live in the now, think of what is happening in the now. In now is all that we need, we hear the guidance, we see the truth. While thoughts are in the now, our minds do not focus on the past or the future which is most of our mind chatter. This is what meditation is and also known as prayer.

[Anders]

Here I found a great analogy of awareness as a camera in different modes. Rupert Spira described it as: "... that allows you to focus in and focus out yes you can focus the camera on a single object or the camera can remain unfocused and just take in the entire visual field. The presence of awareness, we can focus on the content of our conversation or we can relax our focus and simply be be aware of the entire spectrum of our experience without preference or choice." From about 14 minutes into this video:

In ordinary awareness the mind is always focused on thoughts, and through the thinking we experience the world. The new possibility is to take a step back from the thinking and observe everything without through the filter of our thinking.

[Anders]

I discovered a different view than what Rupert Spira described! Or maybe it's the same and just another perspective on the same thing. The new idea I got is that when there is suffering in the now, then something actually needs to change. And the usual way the mind deals with that is to think of what to do and of plans and outcomes and all that.

The new idea is that instead of using thinking to try to change the situation, to relax the thinking to allow the situation to change through the vaster intelligence without the veil. Then there is an acknowledgement of the validity of the thoughts, and it's just that there exists a more powerful way of accomplishing outcomes than through the thinking mind.

So thoughts can then actually be useful as pointers to what needs to be done. And instead of using thinking to try to accomplish what needs to be done to let the vaster intelligence without the veil manage the details of how to achieve the outcomes. Thoughts then become like a sense perception! Instead of a tool for doing things.

[Anders]

How can thoughts be made into a sense perception instead of a tool for doing things? This is a new idea for me so I need to develop it further. As an illustration, if we walk on a path in a forest and then the path turns left in front of us, then we observe that (sense perception) and adjust our direction.

Similarly, our thoughts can see what lays ahead in the future and guide our movements, both physical and psychological, to steer us in the right direction. As an example, let's say that I have a bill to pay. Then instead of me using my thinking mind to pay the bill I simply acknowledge the situation and align myself with the outcome that will happen by itself without me having to think about details about how to achieve the goal, similarly to how I don't have to deal with the details of what muscles to move in order to turn left on a forest path.

This requires that the thoughts become more relevant to what the actual outcomes will be. The usual way we think is to have a lot of "what if" thoughts and all kinds of plans and personal scheming going on. That's like trying to use our eyes to change what is in front of us. For thoughts to be useful as a sense perception they need to better and more directly match the actual situation instead of the usual attempts of the thinking mind to control the future.

[Anders]

Leo Gura has this new video which I first found a bit puzzling but then I realized that much of what he talks about is about removing the veil.

[Nikki]

I discovered a different view than what Rupert Spira described! Or maybe it's the same and just another perspective on the same thing. The new idea I got is that when there is suffering in the now, then something actually needs to change. And the usual way the mind deals with that is to think of what to do and of plans and outcomes and all that.

The new idea is that instead of using thinking to try to change the situation, to relax the thinking to allow the situation to change through the vaster intelligence without the veil. Then there is an acknowledgement of the validity of the thoughts, and it's just that there exists a more powerful way of accomplishing outcomes than through the thinking mind.

So thoughts can then actually be useful as pointers to what needs to be done. And instead of using thinking to try to accomplish what needs to be done to let the vaster intelligence without the veil manage the details of how to achieve the outcomes. Thoughts then become like a sense perception! Instead of a tool for doing things.

My experiences are that in the NOW there is no suffering. One really notices that in the NOW whatever is happening to your body or thoughts, comes in goes in a flash, there is no past and no future. Living in the NOW is your awareness of consciousness.

Our essential nature of pure Awareness has no agenda with the mind, body or world. It is like empty space, completely allowing, and yet indifferent to whatever appears within it. However, it is not a cold, distant indifference: it gives its substance utterly and intimately to whatever appears within it. As such, it is a loving indifference. Be knowingly this loving indifference. — Rupert Spira

[Anders]

@Nikki Many spiritual teachers say the same thing, that suffering is only a mental state. But I include things like emotional and physical pain in suffering.

So then there is perhaps a difference after all. My claim is that when there is suffering in the now then something needs to change, and in suffering I include even emotional, mental and physical pain.

[Anders]

When suffering comes, it fuels the thinking mind! And then when the thoughts are observed such as with mindfulness practice it's already too late. The suffering, produced by the veil, has already fueled the thinking mind and produced thoughts out of that.

The practice then is to catch the suffering before it turns into thoughts. I tried it, and it feels unpleasant. And it's like going against the habit of the mind. I will try it a bit more to see if the suffering can dissolve.

[Nikki]

When suffering comes, it fuels the thinking mind! And then when the thoughts are observed such as with mindfulness practice it's already too late. The suffering, produced by the veil, has already fueled the thinking mind and produced thoughts out of that.

The practice then is to catch the suffering before it turns into thoughts. I tried it, and it feels unpleasant. And it's like going against the habit of the mind. I will try it a bit more to see if the suffering can dissolve.

The body, emotions, mind, ego are all teachers and when you are suffering from one of these, which you feel is suffering, then you should look into yourself, it is not an easy job but must be done or the suffering will continue. In the physical pain it is also a teacher and if one searches the answer will be found. We have to realize that nothing happens to us but through us taught by a Master Teacher. I can honesty see how we as powerful creators teach ourselves through our bodies, emotions, mind/ego. My sister passed from breast cancer last year and it deeply hurts when you lose a sibling. I started to search as to why this happened to her and why she made the decisions she did. There is a book called The Healing Power of Illness (Understanding What Your Symptoms Are Telling You) by Thorwald Dethlefsen and Rudediger Dahlike, MD. I realized all my questions as to why about my sister and also it pointed to my illness and why. I get it now. If your emotions, mind or ego is the cause of your suffering it will lead to physical dis-ease. It is good to understand and know yourself. This book would help many to know themselves and understand at the laws of the universe. May this aid in whatever way you are suffering and know you are loved.

[Anders]

Another thing spiritual teachers sometimes claim is that reality is already perfect and whole. I believe that's correct! Then how can for example a disease be perfect? That seems like insanity.

Ra says that all is whole, complete and perfect. I haven't found information about why this is so yet. My idea is that the veil causes a lot of spiritual entropy which results in death, disease, disorder, conflict and suffering. And the veil is a necessary stage for the purpose of growth and development instead of some mistake.

"Ra: I am Ra. ... One of the primal distortions of the Law of One is that of healing. Healing occurs when a mind/body/spirit complex realizes, deep within itself, the Law of One; that is, that there is no disharmony, no imperfection; that all is complete and whole and perfect." - Law of One 4.20

[jafar]

Another thing spiritual teachers sometimes claim is that reality is already perfect and whole. I believe that's correct! Then how can for example a disease be perfect? That seems like insanity.

Ra says that all is whole, complete and perfect. I haven't found information about why this is so yet. My idea is that the veil causes a lot of spiritual entropy which results in death, disease, disorder, conflict and suffering. And the veil is a necessary stage for the purpose of growth and development instead of some mistake.

Disease is perfect as it is a mechanism to provide catalyst to those who experienced it.
Aging is perfect as it is a mechanism to deteriorate the physical form before finally disabling it.
What is perfect depends on one perspective.

I read in Ra's material that the 'memory veil between incarnation' is a 'recent feature' that's being applied on the game. It causes the 'player' to progress faster, as it brings more 'immersive experience' and each player identify itself with the avatar much faster and much tighter thus pay more serious and focused attention to the game.

Too bad today's VR game technology cannot support that yet, otherwise we will have a good reference for discussion about how such 'immersiveness' of the VR affect the player.

Within today's VR it's very easy for the player to 'disidentify' itself with the avatar inside the game and when the game is not progressing so well he still remember that he is actually outside the game and push the restart / reset button.

While the 'veil of separation' is required in order for the Infinite Creator to experience many ness, it ain't much fun to experience multi player game by yourself isn't it?

This 'veil of separation' between finite amount of consciousness, also named as 'karmic structure' or 'layer of bodies', in sanskrit it's always suffixed with "Maya Kosha" (Virtual Sheathing / Wrapping) as a remembrance that it's virtual by nature and eventually will be dissolved. Releasing the 'wrapped consciousness' inside to rejoin with the infinite ever lasting consciousness, ending the illusionary experience of separation.

As consciousness progress it's focus towards the upper layer of the "Maya Kosha", the "Maya Kosha" will become thinner thus gradually removing the separation effects of the veil.

Telepathy is a good example, when one can read other's thought and send thoughts to others, each will ponder how 'separated' they actually are.
A computer connected to other computers through the internet will feel less separated compared to computer that is not connected to the internet. Mobile network is connecting people nowadays, making each feel less separated to each others.

And also see how consciousness focusing on the upper layer of the Maya Kosha such as Ra can easily access the memory of experience as experienced by other entities, Jesus, Lincoln, Yahweh etc.. A strong indication that the 'veil of separation' is getting thinner as consciousness evolved upward.

[Anders]

I had an awakening! Lion's gate portal? Well, it was only during sleep in a dream, haha. But it was a very advanced dream that became lucid.

In one "scene" in the dream I was led by a small being who looked somewhat like a human from one place to another. The distance was around 100 meters or something like that, but it felt more like an infinite distance. When we arrived at the new location the small being had shriveled up and was about to die it seemed. I thought that what seemed like a short journey for me was an extremely long journey for the being and I had the idea that it would be best to carry the being back to the first location. So I carried the being and ran back to the starting point and the being then had regained vitality.

In a later scene I was walking through some kind of building and had a lucid awakening in the dream, meaning I became aware that it was a dream, and I wondered how real the building was and had an intent to touch the wall and as I reached out to touch the wall nearby I was immediately and automatically transported/flying/hovering through the building at great speed against my will and woke up from the dream.

[Nikki]

[quote='Anders' pid='302775' dateline='1627868806']
Another thing spiritual teachers sometimes claim is that reality is already perfect and whole. I believe that's correct! Then how can for example a disease be perfect? That seems like insanity.

Ra says that all is whole, complete and perfect. I haven't found information about why this is so yet. My idea is that the veil causes a lot of spiritual entropy which results in death, disease, disorder, conflict and suffering. And the veil is a necessary stage for the purpose of growth and development instead of some mistake.

Beautifully written and expressed.