Random Archetype Insights

[Plenum]

if YOU have had an insight into ONE of the Archetypes, but it isn't sizable enough to start a new thread, or would derail an existing one, then please Share it here, in this thread.

think of this as a place of collective wisdom, or group brainstorming on the archetypes. And when the seed has sprouted, someone can then start a new thread with that germinated idea.

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personally, I have been getting a lot of Clarifications in dreams recently. My one last night had to do with the Inner Critic and the LOVERS Card. Let us just say that eternal true lovers (yin/yang, male/female polarity) don't criticize each other, but accept each others' being and essence unconditionally. This is more than 'unconditional love'. It is about a total embracing of the other, with full knowledge of that other.

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[Ankh]

I've had a vision of the Choice, Transformation and Chariot. It's difficult to describe it, but I'll try. It was about - once you made that Choice, deep within itself, there was like a flood rushing in, and transforming everything in its way, and then this flood transforms into a beingness, The Great Way. There is no more confusion in the sense of "what now", "what to do" etc... You know what to do, you know... Words are so difficult to use to describe that vision/understanding/whatever it was...

[EDIT: but there is also some kind of resistance to make that choice. It's like - I know what to do, but something is in the way of doing that! ]

[Plenum]

I've had a vision of the Choice, Transformation and Chariot. It's difficult to describe it, but I'll try. It was about - once you made that Choice, deep within itself, there was like a flood rushing in, and transforming everything in its way, and then this flood transforms into a beingness, The Great Way. There is no more confusion in the sense of "what now", "what to do" etc... You know what to do, you know... Words are so difficult to use to describe that vision/understanding/whatever it was...

hey Ankh - my version of the Chariot is somewhat similiar. I've always seen it as more abstract (basically a circle is all it is) and your Attention/Will/Intent is 'mapped' onto that circle.

sometimes your 'Will/Intent' is outside that circle (not directed), sometimes there is an overlap (a nudging, or an inclination), but when your WILL is fully inside that circle, then a Magikal Konnection can take place between the Mind (the Chariot is the apex of mind), and other parts of reality/existence/self.

it is being able to concentrate that attention/will/intent into the chariot. (the Choice).

[Ankh]

hey Ankh - my version of the Chariot is somewhat similiar. I've always seen it as more abstract (basically a circle is all it is) and your Attention/Will/Intent is 'mapped' onto that circle.

sometimes your 'Will/Intent' is outside that circle (not directed), sometimes there is an overlap (a nudging, or an inclination), but when your WILL is fully inside that circle, then a Magikal Konnection can take place between the Mind (the Chariot is the apex of mind), and other parts of reality/existence/self.

it is being able to concentrate that attention/will/intent into the chariot. (the Choice).

I experience this circle in healing/Gaia meditation workings when it's been successful because of the state of mind I managed to achieve, or perhaps tuning is also a word for it? When there is no detachment to the outcome and there is a good flow of the energy through the indigo, violet and green centers, and I manage to hold a thought of being in the service to One Infinite Creator regardless the outcome of my services, then I see this circle. It starts with the Creator, goes through me, goes to Gaia and then back to the Creator. This activates green ray quite much.

[JustLikeYou]

I'm glad you mentioned the inner critic, plenum. I recently had a very similar discovery. I realized that whenever a voice in my mind speaks, there is separation: the Speaker must be heard by a Listener. The inner critic, then is the Conscious mind which is programming beliefs into the Unconscious mind. The way plenum describes the primordial lovers, Yin and Yang, is the right-hand path relationship (the path of truth). Thus, constant mindfulness of the inner critic is an absolute necessity for this Transformation.

The Transformation of the Mind is all about purity, for me. Purity in whichever polarity is chosen. So the flood rush that you describe, Ankh, is the rush of power that comes with purity, for only the pure are trusted with power. This power, on the right-hand path, manifests as devotion to service to others. The more you serve and the more purely you serve, the more opportunities you will have to do so. Purity is what ushers in the desire to move forward. The vision of the Great Way is the mysterious gift that follows upon the heels of Transformation. Somehow, once the old garbage is released and you finally step forward into a new kind of purity, the mind clears, the context of your life shows itself, and you suddenly know what it is you want and what it is you are meant to do. Naturally, this experience doesn't happen just once but many times over and in different levels of intensity.

[3DMonkey]

Well my favorite that comes to mind is the wobbling of the mind accompanied with the image of prostituting the mind.

100.4 ..
In this image of Transformation of Mind, then, each of the females points the way it would go, but is not able to move, nor are the two female entities striving to do so. They are at rest. The conscious entity holds both and will turn itself one way or the other or, potentially, backwards and forwards, rocking first one way then the other [wobble] and not achieving the transformation. In order for the Transformation of Mind to occur, one principle governing the use of the deep mind must be abandoned.

and

99.8 ...
Many use the trunk and roots of mind as if that portion of mind were a badly used, prostituted entity. Then this entity gains from this great storehouse that which is rough, prostituted, and without great virtue. Those who turn to the deep mind, seeing it in the guise of the maiden, go forth to court it. The courtship has nothing of plunder in its semblance and may be protracted, yet the treasure gained by such careful courtship is great. The right-hand and left-hand transformations of the mind may be seen to differ by the attitude of the conscious mind towards its own resources as well as the resources of other-selves.

http://www.lawofone.info/results.php?cat...&sc=1&ss=1



And here we see it take form via the same avenue of the mind, but with a different style of artistic expression

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Look at 0:20 of the video posted then look at this


  tarot6.jpg (Size: 126.78 KB / Downloads: 14)

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The MIND!!!!

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How doooooes it happen

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  Screen shot 2012-03-22 at 8.50.35PM 3-22-12 wk12.png (Size: 178.62 KB / Downloads: 21)

[abstrktion]

So strange to find this thread today...I was thinking of the Transformation of Mind this morning...and of the painting that I did about a little over a year ago. It doesn't fit the style of the images I've been doing recently, but I'll post it here anyways.

I was listening to a song called "Bogie's Bonnie Bell" in which a girl chooses her mate, but then is prevented from marrying him by her father who doesn't think he's good enough for her (even though she's just had his child...). In any case, it makes me think of the choice--the choice we'd make for ourselves (to serve others) and the choice that often seems more reasonable (that we feel "forced" upon us by circumstances) because it makes us feel safe (serving self--protecting self). Anyways, here is the painting. I titled it "He Loves Her" or "The Choice" (you can click on the image to see it a bit larger)

  ASIBogie's Bell.jpg (Size: 319.86 KB / Downloads: 25)

[Ankh]

The Transformation of the Mind is all about purity, for me. Purity in whichever polarity is chosen. So the flood rush that you describe, Ankh, is the rush of power that comes with purity, for only the pure are trusted with power. This power, on the right-hand path, manifests as devotion to service to others.

Yes, I've had an understanding before that could be liken to the purity you are describing; it was about to have "clean channels" through which this energy/flood could rush. I am widening my perspective about this "cleansing" in this very now though. It is about working with the self, yes, I've always believed in that, but I am now widen the understanding of the Choice coming into this picture, and how this Choice promote the evolution of the mind into Transformation and Great Way. I found this quote particularly interesting in 3DMonkey's post:

[quote='3DMonkey' pid='78137' dateline='1332466547']

100.4 ..
In order for the Transformation of Mind to occur, one principle governing the use of the deep mind must be abandoned.

They are speaking of *the* choice here. And in a very strong way, by saying that one principle must be *abandoned*. My interpretation is that this is the gateway to that straight and narrow path. No more self, just others!

[βαθμιαίος]

I think it's possible to be focused on service to others but still have something of a plundering attitude toward the self. For example, relentlessly pushing oneself to serve in a certain way instead of courting the deep mind in order to find out what its desired service is.

[abstrktion]

I think it's possible to be focused on service to others but still have something of a plundering attitude toward the self. For example, relentlessly pushing oneself to serve in a certain way instead of courting the deep mind in order to find out what its desired service is.

Wow. That's perceptive.

[3DMonkey]

Man. That was my most genius post to date. Difficult to believe its not popular. I'm serious.

[Bring4th_Austin]

Hey Monkey, could you go into a bit more detail about how that song expresses Transformation of Mind? Maybe specifically in relation to the Ra quotes you posted? It wasn't an easy thing for me to follow. I understand the symbolic imagery you posted, but I'm not sure if I got the depth of the archetype from that video and song.

For instance, do you see the lyrics relating to the archetype? What about the rest of the imagery with in the video?

[JustLikeYou]

Yeah, I have to admit, the song's relevance wasn't clear to me either...

You're right, βαθμιαίος, this is why the Transformation of the Mind must be kept in distinction from The Choice. To me, it is The Choice on a lower arc, so to speak. It is the ongoing choice that must be made every single moment: in this situation, shall I accept or manipulate? Seems simple, but it is easy to end up manipulating without realizing it.

[Ankh]

I think it's possible to be focused on service to others but still have something of a plundering attitude toward the self. For example, relentlessly pushing oneself to serve in a certain way instead of courting the deep mind in order to find out what its desired service is.

Don't you think that making the choice, deep within, means to always making the choice to serve others, no matter what? And then, if/when one encounters catalysts, one can balance/work with them later, in for instance meditation/contemplation etc? But when in the situation so to speak, one chooses automatically to always serve other selves, because of that choice already made/realized/accepted on all levels of the self? So yeah, one pushes oneself to serve in one way, but can court the deep mind later, in for instance meditation, on the other hand?

[βαθμιαίος]

Great question! I'll think about it and get back to you.

[Ankh]

I think it's possible to be focused on service to others but still have something of a plundering attitude toward the self. For example, relentlessly pushing oneself to serve in a certain way instead of courting the deep mind in order to find out what its desired service is.

I really liked what you have said here. Being a mom to a five-year old and working long night shifts at a hospice, where people are dying, I face catalysts sometimes, that are presenting situations which are beyond my ability to meet my own expectations of myself.

This whole study of the choice has given me, I suspect, an unrealistic view of that making the choice means, as you say, relentlessly pushing the self to serve in a certain way. But perhaps it is also about that one has not fully discovered all the desires of the self, and therefore, not made that choice on all levels of the self....? Once it is done and the choice is made, one does not have to push the self anymore, as it will be an automatic choice in each moment to serve other selves? Until then there is a wisdom to be learned perhaps (which I believe was stated in one of the Q'uo sessions) that being is doing? I dunno...

[abstrktion]

I really liked what you have said here. Being a mom to a five-year old and working long night shifts at a hospice, where people are dying, I face catalysts sometimes, that are presenting situations which are beyond my ability to meet my own expectations of myself.

God bless you for the work you do. You are an angel to the ones you serve--and to their families.

[Plenum]

I had an INSIGHT into the Chariot -

it is this:

* when the Chariot has been understood, it allows free movement of the mind EVERYWHERE. One is not bound by one's own opinions, or those of others, there is no 'drag' on consciousness. The Chariot shifts over the universe without touching it's feet/wheels.

* freedom of movement of CONSCIOUSNESS.

* the infinity of CONSCIOUSNESS

* unrestricted CONSCIOUSNESS

this card has caused me endless grief in the last few months (maybe even 6 ). But the Great Way, being the summary of all before, seeks to iron out all previous distortions. It ain't meant to be easy!!!!

[βαθμιαίος]

Don't you think that making the choice, deep within, means to always making the choice to serve others, no matter what? And then, if/when one encounters catalysts, one can balance/work with them later, in for instance meditation/contemplation etc? But when in the situation so to speak, one chooses automatically to always serve other selves, because of that choice already made/realized/accepted on all levels of the self? So yeah, one pushes oneself to serve in one way, but can court the deep mind later, in for instance meditation, on the other hand?

Yes, I think I agree, but I also think it's a matter of finding one's deepest path. What if, when you court the deep mind, you realize that it would prefer a different form of service? Or maybe it's feeling the need for rest... But you may have committed yourself to a certain course of service and not be able or not want to switch directions, at least not immediately.

I really liked what you have said here. Being a mom to a five-year old and working long night shifts at a hospice, where people are dying, I face catalysts sometimes, that are presenting situations which are beyond my ability to meet my own expectations of myself.

This whole study of the choice has given me, I suspect, an unrealistic view of that making the choice means, as you say, relentlessly pushing the self to serve in a certain way. But perhaps it is also about that one has not fully discovered all the desires of the self, and therefore, not made that choice on all levels of the self....? Once it is done and the choice is made, one does not have to push the self anymore, as it will be an automatic choice in each moment to serve other selves? Until then there is a wisdom to be learned perhaps (which I believe was stated in one of the Q'uo sessions) that being is doing? I dunno...

I think you're right that it gets into a question of being and doing. I think when we start out on the path we can have a tendency to equate service with doing, but doing can interfere with our ability to court the deep mind.

[JustLikeYou]

This whole study of the choice has given me, I suspect, an unrealistic view of that making the choice means, as you say, relentlessly pushing the self to serve in a certain way. But perhaps it is also about that one has not fully discovered all the desires of the self, and therefore, not made that choice on all levels of the self....? Once it is done and the choice is made, one does not have to push the self anymore, as it will be an automatic choice in each moment to serve other selves?

The very concept of "relentless pushing...in a certain way" has proven, in my experience, to be directly related to the Choice made in the Transformation of the Mind. If one were to treat the unconscious mind as a bride to be courted, one will not push her. Your will in your relation to the bride will be one of devotion to serving her rather than push her like a slave-driver. To serve your unconscious mind means to accept yourself exactly as you are. We often think that if we embrace our deepest desires, we will find them irresistible and therefore we will not have the focus to serve others, but constantly indulge in the self. This is not so. It is very possible to look your desires in the face and embrace them as they are, but still say "no" to the proposition of manifesting those desires. In my life I have had to work through an enormous array of sexual desires which would not be appropriate to act out. But in saying "no" to acting out those desires, that does not mean that I must push myself to deny them or push myself to do things that I think are appropriate in order to hopefully nullify those desires. Rather, I have found it more useful to explore those desires until I unearth something that IS appropriate to act out. Every time I have pushed myself to do something that I thought was an appropriate service, I have found that I would have been wiser to do nothing. This tells me that anything that requires mental pushing lies on the left-hand path in the Transformation of the Mind. On the right-hand path, everything is easy and joyful because there is no pushing. If you explore these concepts, you will find that this Transformation is not as easy as it appears. Each act of pushing is an act of manipulation, even if you are only manipulating yourself. And so often we do things because we think it is "right" or because we "must", not because, from the bottom of our hearts, we want to.

[abstrktion]

This whole study of the choice has given me, I suspect, an unrealistic view of that making the choice means, as you say, relentlessly pushing the self to serve in a certain way. But perhaps it is also about that one has not fully discovered all the desires of the self, and therefore, not made that choice on all levels of the self....? Once it is done and the choice is made, one does not have to push the self anymore, as it will be an automatic choice in each moment to serve other selves?

The very concept of "relentless pushing...in a certain way" has proven, in my experience, to be directly related to the Choice made in the Transformation of the Mind. If one were to treat the unconscious mind as a bride to be courted, one will not push her. Your will in your relation to the bride will be one of devotion to serving her rather than push her like a slave-driver.
Every time I have pushed myself to do something that I thought was an appropriate service, I have found that I would have been wiser to do nothing. This tells me that anything that requires mental pushing lies on the left-hand path in the Transformation of the Mind. On the right-hand path, everything is easy and joyful because there is no pushing. If you explore these concepts, you will find that this Transformation is not as easy as it appears. Each act of pushing is an act of manipulation, even if you are only manipulating yourself. And so often we do things because we think it is "right" or because we "must", not because, from the bottom of our hearts, we want to.

I found this notion of not pushing to be especially true in terms of allowing and accepting in my career--everytime I wanted something that I pursued, it didn't work, but when I just took the opportunities offered, I found that things worked out beautifully--but this is not to say that I didn't have to work hard--but that I did find joy in the working as I could feel myself flowing with the universe instead of against it. It isn't really wise to pit one's will against the machinery of the universe...

[Ankh]

Yes, I think I agree, but I also think it's a matter of finding one's deepest path. What if, when you court the deep mind, you realize that it would prefer a different form of service? Or maybe it's feeling the need for rest... But you may have committed yourself to a certain course of service and not be able or not want to switch directions, at least not immediately.

...................
I think you're right that it gets into a question of being and doing. I think when we start out on the path we can have a tendency to equate service with doing, but doing can interfere with our ability to court the deep mind.

The very concept of "relentless pushing...in a certain way" has proven, in my experience, to be directly related to the Choice made in the Transformation of the Mind. If one were to treat the unconscious mind as a bride to be courted, one will not push her. Your will in your relation to the bride will be one of devotion to serving her rather than push her like a slave-driver. To serve your unconscious mind means to accept yourself exactly as you are. We often think that if we embrace our deepest desires, we will find them irresistible and therefore we will not have the focus to serve others, but constantly indulge in the self. This is not so. It is very possible to look your desires in the face and embrace them as they are, but still say "no" to the proposition of manifesting those desires. In my life I have had to work through an enormous array of sexual desires which would not be appropriate to act out. But in saying "no" to acting out those desires, that does not mean that I must push myself to deny them or push myself to do things that I think are appropriate in order to hopefully nullify those desires. Rather, I have found it more useful to explore those desires until I unearth something that IS appropriate to act out. Every time I have pushed myself to do something that I thought was an appropriate service, I have found that I would have been wiser to do nothing. This tells me that anything that requires mental pushing lies on the left-hand path in the Transformation of the Mind. On the right-hand path, everything is easy and joyful because there is no pushing. If you explore these concepts, you will find that this Transformation is not as easy as it appears. Each act of pushing is an act of manipulation, even if you are only manipulating yourself. And so often we do things because we think it is "right" or because we "must", not because, from the bottom of our hearts, we want to.

I really liked what you've both said here. Thank you. It gives a lot to ponder...

I am just trying to apply spiritual beliefs and understandings in the everyday life. For instance, as I said, being a mom and working a lot, I do find myself in the situations where I am exhausted. What to do? My essence screams to rest, but I can't ignore the calls from the patients, or that my daughter needs a lot of stuff. And I am not talking about taking her to the Disney Land, or something like that... What I am puzzled with is the situations where I am exhausted, and where I want to be left alone, where I don't want to be of service anymore, but yet, being at work, or when taking care of my daughter, I can not *not* to serve. I have to. So that is when I wonder whether it depends upon that choice? That I perhaps have not made it on all levels? But I really loved what you've said, JustLikeYou, about any manipulation, or pushing, being a part of the left-hand path as you've put it. It gave me something to think about.

Thanks for sharing.

[βαθμιαίος]

What I am puzzled with is the situations where I am exhausted, and where I want to be left alone, where I don't want to be of service anymore, but yet, being at work, or when taking care of my daughter, I can not *not* to serve. I have to. So that is when I wonder whether it depends upon that choice? That I perhaps have not made it on all levels?

I have those feelings, too. I think anyone with children can relate. My wife and I often talk about the respect we have for single parents. Add to that your stressful job, and my hat is off to you, dear Ankh!

I think the situation you're describing is maybe not as much about transformation of the mind as it is of the body or the spirit. It's not the case, is it, that you're trying to force your deep mind to give up her secrets to you? Instead, it sounds like you are trying to balance love and wisdom in the situations in which you find yourself.

The reason I mention transformation of the body is that Ra said, in the context of that card, that each moment offers us the opportunity to die and be reborn. That's how I feel when I find myself in a situation where I need to serve yet again even though I really don't feel like it. I find that if I can die and be reborn I can come to the service afresh, and when I do that I feel like my spirit has transformed, risen out of its sarcophagus.

[Ankh]

Señor βαθμιαίος: Muchas gracias!

Veo que necesito más

El amor y la luz y la unidad!

[βαθμιαίος]

No necesitas nada. Eres perfecta exactamente como eres.

[JustLikeYou]

I agree with βαθμιαίος on this one. What you describe sounds like Universe is telling you it is time to approach your situation with different eyes. While pushing yourself to go on is relevant to the Transformation of the Mind, learning to see all situations with the eager and enthusiastic eyes of a child is more properly of the Transformation of the Spirit. I would also say that I have found that when I am exasperated by service it is often because I have not properly used the time I have been allowed for rest. The feeling that one must push oneself to serve may be an attempt by the mind to do work which is of the spirit.

My obligations are not as demanding as yours, but there are occasions when I commit my time and later feel like I have left myself insufficient time alone. When I find that this has happened, I generally keep an eye out for opportunities to de-commit.

[βαθμιαίος]

s'il vous plaît: http://www.bring4th.org/forums/showthrea...2#pid74632

[Plenum]

new question:

this is regards the relationship between the Moon and the Sun.

The Moon, to me, represents a certain level of apprehension and misunderstanding. In the faint light of moon, things can be easily mistaken for another thing; uncertainty seems to be the order of the day.

this Experience of the Spirit is then strengthened by faith so that the Full Light of the Sun can then enter the entity, and reveal things in bright colors (their true nature).

is this how these two archetypes interact/progress?

(I also seem to remember the dark side delighting in the distortions/manipulations of the half-light).

thanks

[Shin'Ar]

new question:

this is regards the relationship between the Moon and the Sun.

The Moon, to me, represents a certain level of apprehension and misunderstanding. In the faint light of moon, things can be easily mistaken for another thing; uncertainty seems to be the order of the day.

this Experience of the Spirit is then strengthened by faith so that the Full Light of the Sun can then enter the entity, and reveal things in bright colors (their true nature).

is this how these two archetypes interact/progress?

(I also seem to remember the dark side delighting in the distortions/manipulations of the half-light).

thanks

Oh wow, this is so exciting to witness in actual progression that it make my fire surge.

Plenum, you are sensing something from deep within that is trying to reveal something to you and you are staring it right in the face.

All you have to do is keep the Light on and you will get this. You are hot on the trail and within striking distance. What you have spoken here is absolutely stunning in its explicit expression of the truth waiting to be revealed. This will give you reason to rethink how you look at the left hand path.

[Ankh]

Just wanted to share an interesting personal experience of Archetype Four:

After studying this Archetype, an experience from the past floated up on the surface of my conscious mind, which has been most difficult. Ra's words appeared in my mind then: "Each experience will need to be observed, experienced, balanced, accepted, and seated within the individual. As the entity grows in self-acceptance and awareness of catalyst the location of the comfortable seating of these experiences will rise to the new true-color entity. The experience, whatever it may be, will be seated in red ray and considered as to its survival content and so forth."

This experience was/is blocked and not accepted by me in the very roots. Then I had an opportunity to take a nap, and before doing so, I asked my Guidance, my unseen family and friends and other positive beings to be of aid to me as to how to proceed with this experience, as I felt to be stuck. I simply didn't know how to move on in this matter.

During this nap, I experienced a very vivid dream. This dream was about cats, and I am not even an overly loving-cats-person, but I dreamt vividly about fluffy, affection giving cats. The connection between these cats and me was intimately loving. This whole dream felt very different.

When I woke up, I knew instantly that these "cats" were symbols representing the cat or the symbol in Archetype Four.

When I was later walking thinking about it all, I experienced these cats again in my conscious mind. The connection between us was once again very intimate and loving. These cats were lovingly striking my back and almost like telling me, or as I could almost hear them in my mind: "We got'ya! We got your back! You go and do your business, do what you came here to do and we got your back! Don't worry!" The love that I felt from/to these cats was like between very, very old and dearest friends, as if we already knew each other our whole life.

I understand these "cats" being symbol/s of the aspect of the Archetype Four. It has to be communicated to the conscious mind in some way, and it is done in symbols that are understandable for the self. Since I've been studying this Archetype, and accepted the cat in this Archetype as a symbol for what it stands for, I was being communicated to in these symbols.

Later on, more happened. I was contemplating this aspect again, and again these cats appeared in my conscious mind, striking my back, giving me love and emotions of being very intimately close with them. And I took a conscious thought of them being an aspect of the Archetype Four, which is in turn an aspect of something bigger, which is Archetypical Mind, which is that blueprint for development of the evolution of the mind, of the body and of the spirit complexes. And I specifically thought of the Archetypes of this particular sub-Logos, and I thought of our sub-logos, being biased towards kindness, being that great Creator under whose care we currently are. And how amazing this sub-logos is, and what a tremendious intelligence it possesses, having set forth these blueprints, these Archetypes, designing evolution, being connected to Logos etc. etc. Until I felt an activation in my whole beingness, and then suddenly I felt a very intense spiraling energy swirling in my root. It was unexpected by me, and kind of took me by surprise, and brought me "back" from whatever realm I was in so to speak.

Anyways, just wanted to share that...

And as to that particularly difficult experience that I mentioned in the beginning, I'm still working on it...