Do higher density beings get free thought?
02-14-2020, 03:02 PM,
#1
Do higher density beings get free thought?
I've read that whatever a higher density being thinks of manifests.

Is this every time?

Can say a 6th density being think of anything without it actually manifesting?

How do they have dark thoughts for instance or think about the "bad" in the Universe
without it manifesting?

Do they get freedom of thought?

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schubert
02-14-2020, 05:31 PM,
#2
RE: Do higher density beings get free thought?
Gem I have like an idea that whatever they think, they could manifest but they perhaps do not see the necessity of it ?

I am reading right now Michael Newton's book the Journey of Souls and it is really interesting that with one of his clients who is doing a regression incarnation, so is being hypnotized, as he is asking questions about the world of spirits, where she goes between incarnations, she says that very advanced souls are sometimes visiting for a few seconds  the places of instruction where as a less advanced soul, she is studying,  but very advanced souls all have great humbleness.  Really interesting,  so I have like a feeling that 6th density entities are like us, just wanting to grow and study more...   lol
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02-14-2020, 11:30 PM, (This post was last modified: 08-03-2020, 02:34 PM by unity100.)
#3
RE: Do higher density beings get free thought?
"Being free" is merely selecting a state of being from the potential states of being, and its only possible when you are looking from a narrow perspective. The states of being, of course, include places of being since being somewhere also is encompassed by the state of being.

When one's perspective approaches infinity towards end of octave, every possibility is already encompassed. There is no 'different state' of being possible anymore, since every state is already encompassed and expressed. Since there remains no potential of 'free will' as could be manifested in this octave, and there remains no need of it anyway.

And as such, the entity leaves this octave behind and merges with infinity for an infinite amount of time, only to manifest in another octave.

And yet, from an infinite perspective, the entity is already manifest in all infinite octaves at the same 'time' anyway, so it starts and ends in mystery, again...
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08-02-2020, 12:48 PM,
#4
RE: Do higher density beings get free thought?
(02-14-2020, 11:30 PM)unity100 Wrote:  "Being free" is merely selecting a state of being from the potential states of being, and its only possible when you are looking from a narrow perspective. The states of being, of course, include places of being since being somewhere also is encompassed by the state of being.

When one's perspective approaches infinity towards end of octave, every possibility is already encompassed. There is no 'different state' of being possible anymore, since every state is already encompassed and expressed. Since there remains no potential of 'free will' as could be manifested in this octave, and there remains no need of it anyway.

And as such, the entity leaves this octave behind and merges with infinity for an infinite amount of time, only to manifest in another octave.

And yet, from an infinite perspective, the entity already manifest in all infinite octaves at the same 'time' anyway, so it starts and ends in mystery, again...

I have been thinking that perhaps, 4D is the peak of free will and individuality. The largest possible variation in possible "worlds" and types of existence. Also the largest possibilities for drastic change, including the most heavenly and hellish developments which in the creation are able to unfold "concretely".

Below 4D, there is increasing mechanical determinism. Psychological and social scientists have figured out dependable recipes (=algorithms) for influencing human behavior, showing that physical humans behave rather mechanically, indeed. Insects are almost like algorithms encased in "flesh", sensing and responding, like computer programs do.

Above 4D, there is increasing conscious determinism. Beings self-determine, choosing the chains of cause and effect which they are incolved in, and the frameworks related to that. Mid-6D may be where that reaches a true mastery. But mid-6D needs to "wait" for the great mind-sync in the last remaining dimension of time in order for all to proceed to 7D.
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08-02-2020, 02:00 PM,
#5
RE: Do higher density beings get free thought?
Ra said that 5D is extremely free.

Doubt everything. Find your own light. - Buddha
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08-02-2020, 02:04 PM,
#6
RE: Do higher density beings get free thought?
(02-14-2020, 03:02 PM)Great Central Sun Wrote:  I've read that whatever a higher density being thinks of manifests.

Is this every time?

Can say a 6th density being think of anything without it actually manifesting?

How do they have dark thoughts for instance or think about the "bad" in the Universe
without it manifesting?

Do they get freedom of thought?

I think there's a very large number of things which can be called "thinking". They are not the same, some may have to do with things manifesting, but others do not. So first of all you need to realize that "mind" can do very different kinds of things, while our language is very crude for trying to describe that.

The problem of language is a big problem with mind-over-matter teachings, because so much is attributed to "thinking" while the range of meaning differs so much that it's like a confusion of tongues, people only superficially speaking the same languages.

I think the kind of 4D thought which is inseparable from the shape and contents of the environment is very different from what minds do at this level. And those who have a higher-density mind, too, can at best get limited glimpses filtered down into the narrow "format" compatible with the physical brain.

It gets even trickier when considering the possibilities for 4D to 6D thought which human imagination cannot even begin to mentally represent, making it impossible to discuss unless technical definitions are arrived at which capture it like an engineering problem.
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08-02-2020, 02:15 PM, (This post was last modified: 08-02-2020, 02:23 PM by Asolsutsesvyl. Edit Reason: add note )
#7
RE: Do higher density beings get free thought?
(08-02-2020, 02:00 PM)Great Central Sun Wrote:  Ra said that 5D is extremely free.

5D would be at a larger distance from physical manifestation. Thus more abstract, less constrained in terms of how things can be limited in space or arrangement of matter.

I think 5D is the first density in which beings get to choose which chains of cause and effect to be involved in, instead of merely, as in 3D-4D, developing or having will to choose how to respond when faced with their contents. (While 4D beings may sculpt timelines, in a more meta way they may be following along in grander chains of cause and effect.)

(The Fourth Way cosmology maps the 5D level to the theosophical "causal" level. The same mapping makes 4D "mental" and 3D "astral". 2D becomes the level of the physical body, 'cause it's made of the same materials as those of animals. Edit: Note that the labels "mental" and "causal" are used in ways very different from, and transcending, the ordinary meaning of the words.)
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08-02-2020, 09:36 PM,
#8
RE: Do higher density beings get free thought?
The best way to understand it as best we can in our limited view is the dream world. When dreaming anything you think of can manifest.

In other ways we also manifest our own reality. It is just done at a deeper level of self than we can normally have any control over.

Consider that the Ra and L/L Research material mentions several time the one thought or the original thought that we are all a part of. Thought is what creates. But just like your thought, to create what you are thinking requires action. So if the thought does not correspond to action then no creation would manifest. The action in this case does not need to be physical. There must be some kind of mental or spiritual action needed for thought to manifest as reality.
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08-02-2020, 09:47 PM, (This post was last modified: 08-02-2020, 09:48 PM by Navaratna.)
#9
RE: Do higher density beings get free thought?
That reminds me of something in a Jane Roberts/Seth book. The idea that atoms and molecules have consciousness. They choose to become what they are in different forms for the sake of experiencing things. For example, a lake may be conscious but that does not mean that it has self reflection. If the same water chose be organized in to a humans brain/circulatory system it would then have experience and self-reflection for the purpose of empathy/evolution.
Samadhi--definition: "the subjective meditator, the act of meditation and the object of meditation merge into oneness."
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08-03-2020, 02:47 PM,
#10
RE: Do higher density beings get free thought?
(08-02-2020, 12:48 PM)Asolsutsesvyl Wrote:  I have been thinking that perhaps, 4D is the peak of free will and individuality. The largest possible variation in possible "worlds" and types of existence. Also the largest possibilities for drastic change, including the most heavenly and hellish developments which in the creation are able to unfold "concretely".

In another respect, in 4d entity is a member of the smc it is in, and it shares its energy, mind, and will with its smc. The will and desires of smc would affect the individual entity and vice versa.

In 3d, the entities are isolated from the effect of other minds/spirits in their society and the planet, however this time it also is a limitation that keeps the entity away from different energies, feelings, thoughts and experiences - while the 4d entity is able to see, feel and experience a lot of things from a distance without even having to change its posture while sitting somewhere...

Its a matter of perspective.

The objective of 3d is to allow the entity to find and confirm its deep, inner polarization with minimal interference. That is why it is isolated from other minds. After the polarity is confirmed, the isolation would become a limitation rather than something that liberates - the entity now wants to act according to its polarity and interact with other selves and being highly isolated would make it more difficult and less satisfying. And less productive.

Quote:Below 4D, there is increasing mechanical determinism. Psychological and social scientists have figured out dependable recipes (=algorithms) for influencing human behavior, showing that physical humans behave rather mechanically, indeed. Insects are almost like algorithms encased in "flesh", sensing and responding, like computer programs do.

The same kind of determinism exists in 3d as well. For every kind of defined subset of existence is just a subset that is created by limiting the possibilities. Otherwise nothing would be possible to do, and what someone does would make it impossible for others to do anything.

Human behavior subsets, other entities' behavior subsets are all subsets that are like 'culture'. They are a given set of models and probabilities from inside which the entities can make understandable and usable choices. A human or insect would not be able to understand and choose anything from an infinite set of choices if they were given such a choice subset.

So, in a sense, different limitation sets of infinite probabilities makes choice, therefore free will, possible.

Quote:Mid-6D may be where that reaches a true mastery. But mid-6D needs to "wait" for the great mind-sync in the last remaining dimension of time in order for all to proceed to 7D.

The more you approach end of 6d and start of 7d, infinity becomes nearer and the entity starts working on completing its infinite existence in this octave. This should decrease, not increase the subset of choices available to the entity since what is desired becomes the completion of the whole entity. All the choices and work done would go in that direction. There is little reason or need for the entity to narrow itself down to a tiny experience in a tiny 3d world to live in a small subset of conditions at random. As the entity nears infinity the choices will become increasingly more obvious.
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08-03-2020, 06:45 PM,
#11
RE: Do higher density beings get free thought?
(08-03-2020, 02:47 PM)unity100 Wrote:  
Quote:Below 4D, there is increasing mechanical determinism. Psychological and social scientists have figured out dependable recipes (=algorithms) for influencing human behavior, showing that physical humans behave rather mechanically, indeed. Insects are almost like algorithms encased in "flesh", sensing and responding, like computer programs do.

The same kind of determinism exists in 3d as well. For every kind of defined subset of existence is just a subset that is created by limiting the possibilities. Otherwise nothing would be possible to do, and what someone does would make it impossible for others to do anything.

Human behavior subsets, other entities' behavior subsets are all subsets that are like 'culture'. They are a given set of models and probabilities from inside which the entities can make understandable and usable choices. A human or insect would not be able to understand and choose anything from an infinite set of choices if they were given such a choice subset.

So, in a sense, different limitation sets of infinite probabilities makes choice, therefore free will, possible.

This reminds me, more loosely, of some old metaphysical speculation I did 10 years ago. The core idea is that limitation defines structure, structure is defined by limitations.

Then I went on to consider 7D in terms of an empty set of limitations. All which is smaller than 7D is then like a non-empty set of limitations. Each such set defines a being or "thing", which is the whole limited by itself to a part of itself.

In related thinking, Fourth Way cosmology describes how there is a branching out into seven cosmoses, proceeding from unity, like a recursive definition (with a threshold limiting how many levels it can go). Each "lower" cosmos which emerges has more laws/limitations/division-of-wills than the previous, and includes the limitations of the previous along with more.

Growth from a lower cosmos to a higher cosmos (and each pair is also like a microcosm and a macrocosm) is the overcoming of a set of laws/limitations, halving the number which the being is subject to and through that, gaining new freedom to "be" in a more expansive way. Until there's only three laws left, at the cosmos corresponding to 6D. Of course, the cosmos after, that of unity, has only one law.

The difference between that and my thinking is the general nature of the Fourth Way idea, which only captures different levels of being, compared to extending the idea to make for a unique set of limitations defining each unique sub-creation identifiable in the creation. And as each thing is defined in relation to the whole, included is the idea that the mode of interaction for ongoing change, and possibilities for transformation, follow from each set.

(08-03-2020, 02:47 PM)unity100 Wrote:  
Quote:Mid-6D may be where that reaches a true mastery. But mid-6D needs to "wait" for the great mind-sync in the last remaining dimension of time in order for all to proceed to 7D.

The more you approach end of 6d and start of 7d, infinity becomes nearer and the entity starts working on completing its infinite existence in this octave. This should decrease, not increase the subset of choices available to the entity since what is desired becomes the completion of the whole entity. All the choices and work done would go in that direction. There is little reason or need for the entity to narrow itself down to a tiny experience in a tiny 3d world to live in a small subset of conditions at random. As the entity nears infinity the choices will become increasingly more obvious.

I think the journey into the end can be thought of as a single-pointed focus. As if the entire creation joins into one through a meditation which excludes all except that point of unity.

As for what I meant by conscious determinism, I considered a simplification of the form that "can do/be", "should do/be", and "will do/be" become logically equivalent. As a result of increased unification of consciousness rather than external limitation.
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08-03-2020, 07:51 PM,
#12
RE: Do higher density beings get free thought?
(08-03-2020, 06:45 PM)Asolsutsesvyl Wrote:  This reminds me, more loosely, of some old metaphysical speculation I did 10 years ago. The core idea is that limitation defines structure, structure is defined by limitations.

Then I went on to consider 7D in terms of an empty set of limitations. All which is smaller than 7D is then like a non-empty set of limitations. Each such set defines a being or "thing", which is the whole limited by itself to a part of itself.

Indeed.

Quote:In related thinking, Fourth Way cosmology describes how there is a branching out into seven cosmoses, proceeding from unity, like a recursive definition (with a threshold limiting how many levels it can go). Each "lower" cosmos which emerges has more laws/limitations/division-of-wills than the previous, and includes the limitations of the previous along with more.

Growth from a lower cosmos to a higher cosmos (and each pair is also like a microcosm and a macrocosm) is the overcoming of a set of laws/limitations

Overcome is an incorrect word.

The limitations/structures which are found in any given subset are what define that given subset. The structure itself, and the accompanying limitations, are a manifestation of that subset of infinity which expresses its nature. They are not overcome, but experienced and then encompassed.

As the entity encompasses a given subset, it becomes larger in vision and encompassing, able to exist as a larger subset of existence and therefore encompass more subsets. This goes all the way to infinity when all subsets are encompassed and no subset is encompassed - due to the nature of infinity.


halving the number which the being is subject to and through that, gaining new freedom to "be" in a more expansive way. Until there's only three laws left, at the cosmos corresponding to 6D. Of course, the cosmos after, that of unity, has only one law.

The difference between that and my thinking is the general nature of the Fourth Way idea, which only captures different levels of being, compared to extending the idea to make for a unique set of limitations defining each unique sub-creation identifiable in the creation. And as each thing is defined in relation to the whole, included is the idea that the mode of interaction for ongoing change, and possibilities for transformation, follow from each set.

Quote:I think the journey into the end can be thought of as a single-pointed focus.

There is no end and there is no beginning. There is one single focus and there are infinite number of infinite focuses. There is focus and there never was a focus.

At point infinity, everything holds true and everything is invalid at the same time. Everything completes each other to absolute balance, canceling out each other. And then again, everything imbalances each other and causes each other to exist.

It all beings and ends in mystery as Ra says. Then again it doesnt, because even mystery itself is a concept that is identifiable. So there must be an equal and opposite counterpart which totally cancels it out. Then again, at the same time, not.
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